Live data from Hacker News

ResearchAgent: Iterative Research Idea Generation Using LLMs

arxiv.org

31–40 of 66 posts

Re: ResearchAgent: Iterative Research Idea Generation Using LLMs

#31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assume free-associations = hallucinations. Assume hallucinations are exactly what makes LLMs useful and your question can be rephrased as "Can you list some examples where LLMs were useful to you?"

Hallucinations are lies. So not the same thing.

Hallucinations are not always lies, they are more like a transformation in the abstraction space.

Re: ResearchAgent: Iterative Research Idea Generation Using LLMs

#32
post #10

I've found where LLMs can be useful in this context is around free-associations. Because they don't really "know" about things, they regularly grasp at straws or misconstrue intended meaning. This, along with the volume of language (let's not call it knowledge) result in the LLMs occasionally bringing in a new element which can be useful.

Can you list some examples where free-associations from LLM were useful to you?

Long, long time ago (1999, before LLM's) I made a virtual museum exhibit creator for education. The collection explorer created a connected graph where the nodes were the works of art and the edges were based on commonalities from their textual descriptions. It used very rudimentary language technology so it 'suffered' from things like homographs. Rather than being seen as a problem, the users liked the serendipity it brought for ideation.

I assume free but not random association could be a comparable support for ideation in research.

Re: ResearchAgent: Iterative Research Idea Generation Using LLMs

#33

A group of PhD students at Stanford recently wanted to take AI/ML research ideas generated by LLMs like this and have teams of engineers execute on them at a hackathon. We were getting things prepared at AGI House SF to host the hackathon with them when we learned that the study did not pass ethical review . I think automating science is an important research direction nonetheless.

That’s pretty wild. What was the reason behind failing ethics review?

I'm generally a proponent of AI and LLM but to me the decision was the right one. You are tasking people with implementing an idea generated by an algorithmic model with (I'm guessing) zero oversight that might have very little training that teaches it the importance of coming up with ideas worth implementing. Some may be more useful than others so it won't be fair from an accomplishment or motivation point of view.

Imagine you've already invested time going to this event and want to win the prize/credit but to do so you have to implement a plugin that makes webpages grayscale because of a random idea generator. Maybe some people would find that interesting but others would see it as wasting their time.

Re: ResearchAgent: Iterative Research Idea Generation Using LLMs

#34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If we keep extrapolating eventually GPT will be omniscient. I really can't think of any reason why that wouldn't be the case, given the exponential curve we find ourselves on.

I think they're being factitious?

I am. And I think it says a lot about the state of things that many people think I'm being completely serious.

Re: ResearchAgent: Iterative Research Idea Generation Using LLMs

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s pretty wild. What was the reason behind failing ethics review?

I'm generally a proponent of AI and LLM but to me the decision was the right one. You are tasking people with implementing an idea generated by an algorithmic model with (I'm guessing) zero oversight that might have very little training that teaches it the importance of coming up with ideas worth implementing. Some may be more useful than others so it won't be fair from an accomplishment or motivation point of view.…

As long as all participants are well-informed then there is absolutely no ethical issue...

Re: ResearchAgent: Iterative Research Idea Generation Using LLMs

#36

A group of PhD students at Stanford recently wanted to take AI/ML research ideas generated by LLMs like this and have teams of engineers execute on them at a hackathon. We were getting things prepared at AGI House SF to host the hackathon with them when we learned that the study did not pass ethical review . I think automating science is an important research direction nonetheless.

I don't think LLMs are the right approach for this. Coordinated science would basically be a search problem where we verify different facts using experiments and use what we learn to determine what experiment to do next.

When you can run experiments quickly it becomes feasible to use ML and evolutionary methods to do novel discoveries, like AlphaTensor's better matrix multiplication than Strassen, and AlphaZero's move 37, upturning centuries of game strategy.

The paper "Evolution through Large Models" shows the way. Just use LLMs as genetic mutation operators. Evolutionary methods are great at search, LLMs are great at intuition but get stuck on their own, they combine well. https://arxiv.org/abs/2206.08896

The interplay between LLMs and Evolutionary Algorithms, despite differing in objectives and methodologies, share a common pursuit of applicability in complex problems. Meanwhile, EA can provide an optimization framework for LLM's further enhancement under black box settings, empowering LLM with flexible global search capacities.

Since chatGPT was first released hundreds of millions of people have been using it for assistance, and the model outputs influenced their actions, maybe even supported scientists to make new discoveries. The LLM text is filtered through people and ends up as real world consequences and discoveries that are reported in text, and get in the next training set closing the loop.

Trillions of AI tokens per month do this slow feedback game. AI speeds up the circulation of useful information and ideas in human society, and AI feedback gets filtered by the contact with people and the real world.

Re: ResearchAgent: Iterative Research Idea Generation Using LLMs

#37
post #10

I've found where LLMs can be useful in this context is around free-associations. Because they don't really "know" about things, they regularly grasp at straws or misconstrue intended meaning. This, along with the volume of language (let's not call it knowledge) result in the LLMs occasionally bringing in a new element which can be useful.

Can you list some examples where free-associations from LLM were useful to you?

A lot of where I've benefited is in some marketing language. Rarely, or almost never has ChatGPT come up with something and I've thought "that's exactly what we wanted", but through iterations, it's taken me down paths I might not have found myself.

Unfortunately, ChatGPT doesn't have a good search interface, so I can't search through older chats, but I know when I was looking at re-naming our company, it didn't come up with our new name, but it lead me down a path which did lead to our name.

I was trying to understand a patent, and we were looking at the algorithm which was being used. ChatGPT misunderstood how the algorithm worked, but pointed to it's knowledge of a similar algorithm which worked differently, but was better suited to our purposes.

Calling this "free-association" may be taking some liberty. Many people would consider these errors, or hallucinations, but in some ways, they do look very similar to what many would call free-association IMO.

Re: ResearchAgent: Iterative Research Idea Generation Using LLMs

#38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assume free-associations = hallucinations. Assume hallucinations are exactly what makes LLMs useful and your question can be rephrased as "Can you list some examples where LLMs were useful to you?"

Hallucinations are lies. So not the same thing.

For LLM to lie it would need to know the truth. That's an incredible level of anthropomorphization.

Re: ResearchAgent: Iterative Research Idea Generation Using LLMs

#39
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you list some examples where free-associations from LLM were useful to you?

Assume free-associations = hallucinations. Assume hallucinations are exactly what makes LLMs useful and your question can be rephrased as "Can you list some examples where LLMs were useful to you?"

Is not the purpose of a model to interpolate between two points? This is the underlying basis of "hallucinations" (when that works out /not/ in our favour) or "prediction" (when it does). So it's a matter of semantics and a bit of overuse of the term "hallucination". But the model would be useless as nothing more than a search engine if it were to just regurgitate it's training data verbatim.

Re: ResearchAgent: Iterative Research Idea Generation Using LLMs

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s pretty wild. What was the reason behind failing ethics review?

I'm generally a proponent of AI and LLM but to me the decision was the right one. You are tasking people with implementing an idea generated by an algorithmic model with (I'm guessing) zero oversight that might have very little training that teaches it the importance of coming up with ideas worth implementing. Some may be more useful than others so it won't be fair from an accomplishment or motivation point of view.…

Surely the ideas themselves are what should be examined for ethical suitability, rather than the meta-idea of “ask an LLM for ideas”?
Post reply on HN