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Why is it so hard to build an airport?

construction-physics.com

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Re: Why is it so hard to build an airport?

#31

Post by amelius »

rikafurude21 wrote: post #23
xrd wrote: post #7

Very interesting to see how the noise of jet engines declined significantly. While reading the article I kept thinking, it feels like investing in noise reduction would really pay off, and then a few paragraphs later, there it was. I'm also intrigued by small airports, like the one in Rio, Santos Dumont. The shortest runways in the world. If you could reduce noise and control pollution, it is very nice to have an air…

Going from 120-110 down to 100-90 isnt really a significant decline, it went from unbearably torturous to really annoying. Airports nowadays still create significant noise pollution in their surroundings.

Yes, from the graph it seems we've almost reached the asymptote and noise isn't going down much from here.

Re: Why is it so hard to build an airport?

#32

Post by mc32 »

jorisboris wrote: post #24

When building https://randomairport.onrender.com/ I noticed that US and Euro airports always look very different Somehow US airports always seem to be surrounded by densely populated residential areas, even in the direction of the runways, while Euro airports don’t seem to have this problem. And secondly Us airports always seem to take huge plots of land compared to Euro airports. My assumption is that Us cities are…

Most US airports were built early before we had the current population. When they began as airports, they were mostly on the periphery, with exceptions.

Re: Why is it so hard to build an airport?

#33

Post by marcinzm »

rikafurude21 wrote: post #23
xrd wrote: post #7

Very interesting to see how the noise of jet engines declined significantly. While reading the article I kept thinking, it feels like investing in noise reduction would really pay off, and then a few paragraphs later, there it was. I'm also intrigued by small airports, like the one in Rio, Santos Dumont. The shortest runways in the world. If you could reduce noise and control pollution, it is very nice to have an air…

Going from 120-110 down to 100-90 isnt really a significant decline, it went from unbearably torturous to really annoying. Airports nowadays still create significant noise pollution in their surroundings.

>it went from unbearably torturous to really annoying

That's like saying the difference between getting stabbed and pushed isn't big since both are physical assaults. It is. 120 is at the level of ear injury and pain even in the short duration of a takeoff. 90 isn't.

Re: Why is it so hard to build an airport?

#34

Post by DarkNova6 »

jorisboris wrote: post #24

When building https://randomairport.onrender.com/ I noticed that US and Euro airports always look very different Somehow US airports always seem to be surrounded by densely populated residential areas, even in the direction of the runways, while Euro airports don’t seem to have this problem. And secondly Us airports always seem to take huge plots of land compared to Euro airports. My assumption is that Us cities are…

Actually, apart from the largest US cities your average european city is larger. The US doesn't even have 10 cities which are above 1 million people.

Re: Why is it so hard to build an airport?

#35

Post by revlolz »

bell-cot wrote: post #2

Long & interesting...but a pretty good tl;dr; is: "NIMBY's are why we can't build any major infrastructure any more".

The data the author presents spells out that aircraft are still twice as loud as passenger cars at their quietest. The majority of traffic through smaller municipal airports is very loud propeller aircraft. I don't believe it makes anyone a nimby to not want a freaking airport nearby. I don't think anyone should have to live with such disturbances without voting and ample regulations. It should be incredibly difficult to get airports built. The commerce benefits to the town/city come at the direct expense of health and quality living of residents. The article fixates on noise pollution, but what about exposure to cancerous chemicals? Actual pollution from emissions? Traffic consequences?

It's not just some affluent boomer's view or lawn getting impacted. Personally, I never want to live in vicinity of an airport ever again in my life.

Re: Why is it so hard to build an airport?

#36

Post by jojobas »

arrowsmith wrote: post #11
anonzzzies wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And the state really shouldn’t care about these few. Probably rich enough to move but don’t want because blah blah.

"Few"? Almost no-one wants to live next door to an airport.

If this was true, areas around airports would have been non-residential or at least stupidly penalized in land value. They don't seem to be.

In fact when you live close to an airport you stop caring, perhaps not unlike smoke alarm chirps but without danger to your life.

Re: Why is it so hard to build an airport?

#37

Post by rmccue »

showerst wrote: post #15
dkdbejwi383 wrote: post #12

The new Nancy Bird Walton airport in western Sydney is interesting. The existing airport is very close to the CBD and residential areas, and completely hemmed in by those and the bay it sits next to, so has little room to expand. It's also subject to a strict curfew being so close to residential areas. The new airport is huge, being built at an impressive speed, and is going to be on a new metro line (which strangely…

Sounds very similar to Dulles in Washington DC. We eventually ran a rail line to it, and it eventually wasn’t the middle of nowhere any more. Hopefully the rail link takes less than 60 years in your case =)

Sydney Metro is being expanded out to it; construction's already underway, and is targeted at opening at the same time as the airport: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Western_Sydney_Airport_line

Re: Why is it so hard to build an airport?

#38

Post by mc32 »

DarkNova6 wrote: post #34
jorisboris wrote: post #24

When building https://randomairport.onrender.com/ I noticed that US and Euro airports always look very different Somehow US airports always seem to be surrounded by densely populated residential areas, even in the direction of the runways, while Euro airports don’t seem to have this problem. And secondly Us airports always seem to take huge plots of land compared to Euro airports. My assumption is that Us cities are…

Actually, apart from the largest US cities your average european city is larger. The US doesn't even have 10 cities which are above 1 million people.

That’s only if you count within strict city limits. Metro areas, not to mention MSAs consists of larger pops.

Re: Why is it so hard to build an airport?

#39

Post by blamazon »

po wrote: post #30

If you fly into Tokyo you might come in via Narita Airport (NRT) which is actually quite a distance out from tokyo. Violence is extremely uncommon in modern Japan but NRT was the site of violent resistance over several decades. Opposition forces killed several police officers, rioted on several occasions and constructed a giant 200 ft tower to interfere with test flights. Hundreds of acts of vandalism have occurred o…

The next couple airports in Japan to be built were built over water on artificial islands:

Kansai International: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kansai_International_Airport

Kobe: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kobe_Airport

Kitakyushu: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kitakyushu_Airport

Chubu International: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chubu_Centrair_International_A...

Re: Why is it so hard to build an airport?

#40

Post by Beijinger »

DarkNova6 wrote: post #34
jorisboris wrote: post #24

When building https://randomairport.onrender.com/ I noticed that US and Euro airports always look very different Somehow US airports always seem to be surrounded by densely populated residential areas, even in the direction of the runways, while Euro airports don’t seem to have this problem. And secondly Us airports always seem to take huge plots of land compared to Euro airports. My assumption is that Us cities are…

Actually, apart from the largest US cities your average european city is larger. The US doesn't even have 10 cities which are above 1 million people.

"The US doesn't even have 10 cities which are above 1 million people. reply"

I did not believe this and googled it. It is true.

1 Million would be tiny in China. Province.

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