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Wyze security incident update

forums.wyze.com

31–40 of 161 posts

Re: Wyze security incident update

#31

This is one of the things Apple does right. HomeKit working local is a pretty great setup and just works. I put my HomeKit cameras on a VLAN without internet and device isolation and they still work seamlessly. The hard part is getting cameras that are wireless. I use scrypted but even then, getting ONVIF or RTSP isn’t as straight forward nowadays. I also have a local frigate backup which works great too. You can pip…

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Re: Wyze security incident update

#32
post #4

Nobody should ever be surprised that sending video to someone else’s computer (ie “the cloud”) results in third parties viewing that video.

Or buying cheap, no-brand or upstart brand cameras with cloud capabilities. I had a heck of a time finding a proper POE recording DVR camera system for my mom's house without online or cloud bullshit, but still I isolated it on the network to not take any chances of UPnP port opening or dial-home crap. The only system I would trust would be one that laid out their security model, source to their apps, and had a self-…

Got any brand/model recommendations? I also want to run full local.

Re: Wyze security incident update

#33

> The incident was caused by a third-party caching client library that was recently integrated into our system. This client library received unprecedented load conditions caused by devices coming back online all at once. As a result of increased demand, it mixed up device ID and user ID mapping and connected some data to incorrect accounts. That seems like enough of a line of bullshit to steer me away from ever using…

Do you think the issue was something else? "People randomly see other people's content" is an issue that would immediately make me think some issue with caching is the culprit. Given their openness in the rest of the communications, I don't see why they would make this part up. Edit: Of course, I'm also curious what the actual bug was. A discussion below is suggesting several plausible ways (e.g. concurrency issues,…

> Do you think the issue was something else?

No, I'm not questioning whether or not it was a caching issue. I'm taking exception to the lack of accountability. They chose the library. They (probably) chose to ignore a documented or common failure mode of caching systems through either poor choice of key or lack of synchronization. They've obviously designed their infrastructure in a way that isn't resilient to its current level of usage (cold start is a normal part of software's lifecycle).

They could have chosen to own that, but instead they blamed everyone else. That's not a sign of a trustworthy service provider.

Re: Wyze security incident update

#34

This is one of the reasons why you want end-to-end encryption wherever possible. Even a bad implementation with cloud-synced encryption keys (which defeats most of the benefits of e2e) would have stopped this. The response in this case (notifying customers and specifically stating whether they were affected or not) is excellent, but this seems to be a repeat of a previous incident from September 2023: https://www.the…

I wonder how many people would continue to so casually use these services if they understood that, for the most part, there is rarely proper end-to-end encryption of their data with these services. It is awfully disingenuous when these companies' marketing materials describe their services as "encrypted" when it usually just means there are two independent TLS pipes, which both terminate in their "cloud"; this surely gives a false sense of security to end-users who may not understand the implications of such a setup.

Re: Wyze security incident update

#35
Not my project but I have had great success with https://github.com/gtxaspec/wz_mini_hacks & V3 model.

The V3 models need to be downgraded to a specific firmware first and patching it exposes RSTP streams using https://github.com/AlexxIT/go2rtc. Everything doable without ever installing Wyze app on an environment air gapped environment with no internet.

Re: Wyze security incident update

#37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm also curious what the actual bug was Hardware. Rowhammer-type effects occurring accidentally under sudden load spikes. The hardware has just got too dense. (I should clarify this is speculation, but reading the recent article included here on sudo using special maximum-distance bitfields to hold state internally ( https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=39165342 )... it must be a problem that's being observed in t…

I can't imagine that happening with a sufficient frequency. A system making such mistakes so often would just be too unstable to keep an uptime >1h.

With the 'cattle not pets' mindset that pervades modern development is the lifespan of ephemeral cache VMs that closely monitored? They get spun up and down on demand in most architectures. I can see this being an edge case failure when the system is trying to scale up, the existing VMs are getting absolutely hammered, the hypervisor is trying to start up new ones, memory pressure and iops on the existing ones are maxed out...

It just seems like the most obvious root cause to me, a single bit-flip in a hashed value is going to give you the wrong result data without any other error because the hash value is already essentially heavily compressed, meanwhile the hash table is almost certain to be 100% stored in memory and very heavily accessed from multiple directions in a read/write manner.

Re: Wyze security incident update

#38
post #30

A little off topic, but how is it possible that a tech startup named itself “Wyze” and didn’t get sued by Google over the “Waze” trademark? In some accents it sounds exactly the same, and they’re sort of in an adjacent product space.

Am I the only one that saw Wyze and thought Wyse? Guess I'm old.

Re: Wyze security incident update

#39
“Don’t use Wyze” seems like the wrong takeaway from this.

I’d go with “don’t put internet-connected cameras in your house if you don’t want those images on the internet”. I’ve got a Wyze in my garage looking over my mountain bikes, and for $35 I don’t really care if somebody else sees that image. But I’d never put one in my living space, regardless of their security track record.

Re: Wyze security incident update

#40
post #38
post #30

A little off topic, but how is it possible that a tech startup named itself “Wyze” and didn’t get sued by Google over the “Waze” trademark? In some accents it sounds exactly the same, and they’re sort of in an adjacent product space.

Am I the only one that saw Wyze and thought Wyse? Guess I'm old.

Right, that’s another one. I get that the trademark space is pretty dense, but still - trademarks exist to stop consumers getting confused, and this naming really is confusing?

Waze could come out with a line of dash cams, and then you'd have Waze cams and Wyze cams.

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