31–40 of 236 posts
When has UBI actually every been tried? I don't think any trials really qualify as "Universal". IMO the universal part is the hard part and changes it drastically. Compared to a small limited trial of giving people money, where does it all come from when it's actually universal? And what are the effects on the overall economy when it's universal?
> what are the effects on the overall economy when it's universal? Inflation.
I don't think anyone is doubting that giving people money improves their lives. That seems to be the conclusion of these studies. However what is seemingly _never_ studied is how to finance such an operation. The money has to come out of the system somewhere. Is it with new taxation on XYZ, or slashing services somewhere else etc.
Money isn't zero sum. We've never let such concerns interfere with funding wars.
I don't think anyone is doubting that giving people money improves their lives. That seems to be the conclusion of these studies. However what is seemingly _never_ studied is how to finance such an operation. The money has to come out of the system somewhere. Is it with new taxation on XYZ, or slashing services somewhere else etc.
Money isn't zero sum. We've never let such concerns interfere with funding wars.
In the US, we gave money to people during the pandemic. Worker shortages in low-skill labor resulted and inflation hit 10%. I think that's the major flaw - young, childless people without responsibility see no reason to work, when they can watch Netflix all day, either paying their mom some token rent or sharing a flop house with a bunch of friends.
I would like to counter with first hand observed real world evidence. Raising the minimum wage near where I live (Seattle area) has raised the prices of everything. Rent seeking land owners raise their rents, which passes through to everything and absorbs the water trying to sate the parched desert. IMO either directly supplying what UBI is supposed to provide, or encouraging local supply to match the market need, th…
Minimum wage and ubi are totally different, though? Why would you expect them to have the same effect? Or are you arguing that people need to be poor?
There are a number of effects that boost disposable income in the US: lower tax brackets, tax credits, minimum wage, etc. I don't think anyone is arguing that people need to be poor, just illustrating that it's difficult to really say what the effect will be of increasing disposable income.
Isolated studies of UBI suffer from this same problem. A localized increase in spending power may not tip the wider economy, but if everyone had it? That really might. We just don't know.
I don't think anyone is doubting that giving people money improves their lives. That seems to be the conclusion of these studies. However what is seemingly _never_ studied is how to finance such an operation. The money has to come out of the system somewhere. Is it with new taxation on XYZ, or slashing services somewhere else etc.
Military budget?
It's also not a particularly new idea. The Roman empire had UBI in the form of Cura Annonae.
I don't think anyone is doubting that giving people money improves their lives. That seems to be the conclusion of these studies. However what is seemingly _never_ studied is how to finance such an operation. The money has to come out of the system somewhere. Is it with new taxation on XYZ, or slashing services somewhere else etc.
Money isn't zero sum. We've never let such concerns interfere with funding wars.
Taxation in the US came about to fund a war.
Money is in the top-three concerns people have about war; it's right after lives lost and infrastructure destroyed.
I don't think anyone is doubting that giving people money improves their lives. That seems to be the conclusion of these studies. However what is seemingly _never_ studied is how to finance such an operation. The money has to come out of the system somewhere. Is it with new taxation on XYZ, or slashing services somewhere else etc.
> or slashing services somewhere else Military budget?
When has UBI actually every been tried? I don't think any trials really qualify as "Universal". IMO the universal part is the hard part and changes it drastically. Compared to a small limited trial of giving people money, where does it all come from when it's actually universal? And what are the effects on the overall economy when it's universal?
> what are the effects on the overall economy when it's universal? Inflation.