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Organ playing 639-year-long piece changes chord

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Re: Organ playing 639-year-long piece changes chord

#31
post #8

> His most famous piece, 4'33", is designed to be played by any combination of instruments - but musicians are instructed not to play them. This is even better played back from a digital recording. You need those gold audio cables to truly appreciate the silence.

John Cage's 4'33" is probably one of the best jokes in music.

I personally learned about 4'33" in a music class, where it was performed live -- basically it was 4'33" of ambient noise, but there was a lot of tension if you didn't know what to expect. During the final exam for the class, the professor would play some recording and we were supposed to identify the music, and all of us would start writing "John Cage's 4 minutes 33 seconds" when the professor was too slow to start the next song.

There was also an incident where apparently Mike Batt copied 4'33" and named his song "A One Minute Silence", which resulted in an 6-figure court settlement[1], although later news said it was just £1000[2]. I also heard a version of the story that they didn't settle at all, because John Cage's publishers couldn't prove which minute out of the 4'33" was copied.

[1] https://edition.cnn.com/2002/SHOWBIZ/Music/09/23/uk.silence/

[2] https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-hampshire-11964995

Re: Organ playing 639-year-long piece changes chord

#32
post #12

Its fascinating how the interest and energy around a project like this manages to be self-reinforcing. The idea on the face of it is quite nonsensical: building a machine to make continuous droning sounds for years at a time. How likely is it that the song actually would play to completion? The fascination is that it is not impossible that the effort will succeed, and its already gone far enough to be quite amazing i…

how is it nonsensical?

Because it's not something which will ever be pleasant to listen to, and thus is missing the entire point of music. All for some weird novelty thing.

Re: Organ playing 639-year-long piece changes chord

#33
post #8

> His most famous piece, 4'33", is designed to be played by any combination of instruments - but musicians are instructed not to play them. This is even better played back from a digital recording. You need those gold audio cables to truly appreciate the silence.

John Cage's 4'33" is probably one of the best jokes in music. I personally learned about 4'33" in a music class, where it was performed live -- basically it was 4'33" of ambient noise, but there was a lot of tension if you didn't know what to expect. During the final exam for the class, the professor would play some recording and we were supposed to identify the music, and all of us would start writing "John Cage's 4…

In Cage's original performances, he had a page turner. No joke.

Re: Organ playing 639-year-long piece changes chord

#34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how is it nonsensical?

Because it's not something which will ever be pleasant to listen to, and thus is missing the entire point of music. All for some weird novelty thing.

to you, maybe

Re: Organ playing 639-year-long piece changes chord

#35
post #8

> His most famous piece, 4'33", is designed to be played by any combination of instruments - but musicians are instructed not to play them. This is even better played back from a digital recording. You need those gold audio cables to truly appreciate the silence.

John Cage's 4'33" is probably one of the best jokes in music. I personally learned about 4'33" in a music class, where it was performed live -- basically it was 4'33" of ambient noise, but there was a lot of tension if you didn't know what to expect. During the final exam for the class, the professor would play some recording and we were supposed to identify the music, and all of us would start writing "John Cage's 4…

Is there a test of originality for copyright? I wouldn’t call myself vehemently anti copyright but when the idea of “let’s just not play and the ambient sound of the orchestra sitting there is music instead” is the basis for the copyright it does make me question the validity of it. When someone who has done XYZ drug of choice and can come up with that idea in their drug addled state of mind as a pretty good first pass (if I were to to smoke marijuana and you asked me of a clever avant garde music idea, the concept of 4’33’’ is probably be one of the top three I would just list right off the bat not knowing of Cage) I really do question whether you should be able to copyright that idea. It’s even a bit of a hippie meme “what if the music is everything around us? Har har”

By the way I love 4’33” and don’t denigrate it - the way Cage executed the idea is flawless - which is one of the reasons it’s so timeless. I just don’t think it’s something you can copyright. And indeed, the stories you linked indicate that, though rather than point out the ridiculousness of the situation they simply used it as a money and publicity making opportunity.

Re: Organ playing 639-year-long piece changes chord

#36

One quip: this piece is not "as slow as possible". One could write a piece of "music" that is one note to be played at the heat death of the universe, or a piece that is silence forever. It's fun to play with the definition of "music" like John Cage did his whole career, but the title of his piece is technically incorrect, the worst kind of incorrect.

I mean, you could play his piece at a speed designed to spread it out evenly from the present until the (predicted) moment when the universe can no longer support the mechanism used to play it. That would literally be "as slow as possible", and seems technically fine.

Re: Organ playing 639-year-long piece changes chord

#37

"Some people reportedly booked tickets years in advance to experience Monday's chord change" Clearly they're attention seekers—their rustling about in seats or asleep and snoring from boredom would be far more entertaining than the actual performance. One has to wonder what kind of people are drawn to a musical event where if it were compared with say Bach's Passacaglia and Fugue BWV 582 then the latter's performance…

Its fun! Why are people so excited about eclipses or cicadas?

I don't think everyone is being performative or doing it for attention (what attention)

Re: Organ playing 639-year-long piece changes chord

#38

"Some people reportedly booked tickets years in advance to experience Monday's chord change" Clearly they're attention seekers—their rustling about in seats or asleep and snoring from boredom would be far more entertaining than the actual performance. One has to wonder what kind of people are drawn to a musical event where if it were compared with say Bach's Passacaglia and Fugue BWV 582 then the latter's performance…

It's like they're all afraid of admitting the obvious, because some "famous guy" will tell them they're wrong. If that's not a textbook example of the sin of human respect, I don't know what is. Foolishness 1, Reason 0.

"Foolishness 1, Reason 0."

A variation on the Emperor's new clothes methinks.

Re: Organ playing 639-year-long piece changes chord

#39

"Some people reportedly booked tickets years in advance to experience Monday's chord change" Clearly they're attention seekers—their rustling about in seats or asleep and snoring from boredom would be far more entertaining than the actual performance. One has to wonder what kind of people are drawn to a musical event where if it were compared with say Bach's Passacaglia and Fugue BWV 582 then the latter's performance…

Its fun! Why are people so excited about eclipses or cicadas? I don't think everyone is being performative or doing it for attention (what attention)

Total eclipses have no equal—on earth anyway. I've had the great privilege of having seen three over the course of my lifetime. They're not normal experiences, they're something else again.

Re: Organ playing 639-year-long piece changes chord

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

how is it nonsensical?

Because it's not something which will ever be pleasant to listen to, and thus is missing the entire point of music. All for some weird novelty thing.

Not all music is pleasant, nor should it be.
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