Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

In Europe, trains are full, and more are on the way

nytimes.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 229 posts

Re: In Europe, trains are full, and more are on the way

#31

Post by enaaem »

layer8 wrote: post #20
k__ wrote: post #3

Trains are pretty awesome, especially in small Europe. Flying always comes with security hassle. A train is just: get in/get out. If Europe would just spent more money on infrastructure. We have trains in Germany that can do 350km/h but I've yet to ride one that goes faster than 200, probably because the rails aren't what they're used to be. Then we have the Germany Ticket. A 50€/month subscription to all regional tr…

Japan has it easier in terms of network topology. Compare https://keikaku-japan.com/sites/default/files/uploads/map-jr... with https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/0/08/Bahnstre... , and the fact that the latter isn’t an island.

Distances on a square are shorter on average for the same area of land.

Re: In Europe, trains are full, and more are on the way

#32

Post by scott_w »

muspimerol wrote: post #28
kibwen wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> especially in small Europe What's small about the scale of Europe in this context? Even taking the extremely conservative measurement of Madrid to Berlin, that's 1200 miles/2000 km, which is comparable to the entire length of the Japanese isles, or the distance from Beijing to the South China Sea, or the distance from Boston to Minneapolis and/or Miami. Speaking as an American, I'd be over the moon if our passenger…

The scale of the country is an excuse in many cases. There are densely populated areas in many parts of the USA, but nearly all of Europe is densely populated. The EU has an average density of 112 people per square km compared to 36 in the USA. The USA still can and should do better, but there are important geographical differences to the EU. And as an aside, I don't think many Europeans are taking the train from Mad…

> The EU has an average density of 112 people per square km compared to 36 in the USA.

Isn't that a misleading statistic, though? It's not like the USA is an evenly spread wasteland in comparison to Continental Europe. It's more like pockets of high population density throughout, which trains can handle perfectly well. Russia and Ukraine are similar in that they're pockets of cities separated by miles of steppe. Both are known for heavily using rail travel.

Hell, wasn't the USA built on the back of continental rail travel during its industrial revolution?

Re: In Europe, trains are full, and more are on the way

#33

Post by bondant »

ivan_gammel wrote: post #18
eigenket wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In my opinion the main "low hanging fruit" Europe has with trains are international birders, especially if they're trying to compete with flying. Trains in Poland work great, trains in Germany work pretty well but every train I've taken between Poland and Germany has been delayed. The standard thing is that while you're in Poland they claim the delay is because of previous delays in Germany and while you're in German…

In December I could not even buy tickets online to a train from Berlin to Warsaw because DB website is terrible. Had to cancel my trip — this is really a shame, that EU cannot fix cross-border connectivity.

Couldn't you book with another ticket seller? Like trainline.eu?

Re: In Europe, trains are full, and more are on the way

#34

Post by Philpax »

DrDroop wrote: post #27

Sorry to burst your bubble but the trains in western Europe are a transport mode that caters to a specific class of people, mainly urban well educated people that work for in government, academia or for big corporations. I would occasionally take a train to go to a conference if the venue is close to the station otherwise it is just not practical.

Er, no, not really? I live in Sweden and a large slice of society take the trains. Ditto everywhere else I've been in Western Europe. Is it possible that your train network specifically is mediocre?

Re: In Europe, trains are full, and more are on the way

#35

Post by scott_w »

Freak_NL wrote: post #25
erk__ wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is daily trains between all the countries you named (at least those that share a border) most of them are no different than any other border crossing with exception of the trains going to and from England as you have to go through security for that one. I don't remember ever having a bad experience crossing a border when I was on InterRail some years back.

Really. Crossing borders within the Schengen-zone is trivial and goes unnoticed for most travellers. You can even cross multiple borders in your sleep on the night trains.

It's so seamless that I was racing someone through Belgium and only realised I'd entered the Netherlands when I got a text telling me I was on a Dutch phone network!

Re: In Europe, trains are full, and more are on the way

#36

Post by [deleted] »

GrumpySloth wrote: post #26

> Amid concerns about climate change, demand for rail service is strong This attempt at spinning it as people being motivated to use trains out of concern for the climate is hilarious. Almost nobody thinks like that. Trains are just a hell of a lot more convenient than alternative modes of transport for long distance trips.

[deleted]

Re: In Europe, trains are full, and more are on the way

#37

Post by tompagenet2 »

GrumpySloth wrote: post #26

> Amid concerns about climate change, demand for rail service is strong This attempt at spinning it as people being motivated to use trains out of concern for the climate is hilarious. Almost nobody thinks like that. Trains are just a hell of a lot more convenient than alternative modes of transport for long distance trips.

I'm sure there are a mix of reasons. It's definitely significant for us and as we went to Cornwall this year we spoke to people on the way there and way back who offered this without promting for why they took the train. Different people may choose trains for a mix of different reasons.

Re: In Europe, trains are full, and more are on the way

#38

Post by kristiandupont »

GrumpySloth wrote: post #26

> Amid concerns about climate change, demand for rail service is strong This attempt at spinning it as people being motivated to use trains out of concern for the climate is hilarious. Almost nobody thinks like that. Trains are just a hell of a lot more convenient than alternative modes of transport for long distance trips.

>Almost nobody thinks like that.

I have no data but I personally think like that and I have had conversations with friends who think like that. Why do you think demand is increasing then -- the convenience you mention isn't new?

Re: In Europe, trains are full, and more are on the way

#39

Post by timthelion »

bluGill wrote: post #17
kibwen wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> especially in small Europe What's small about the scale of Europe in this context? Even taking the extremely conservative measurement of Madrid to Berlin, that's 1200 miles/2000 km, which is comparable to the entire length of the Japanese isles, or the distance from Beijing to the South China Sea, or the distance from Boston to Minneapolis and/or Miami. Speaking as an American, I'd be over the moon if our passenger…

Europe mostly speaks a different language in every country, so the actual scale of Europe isn't the whole continent (or whole EU), but a single country. Sure you can travel to other countries, but there is a language barrier (though English is common enough to get by most places). Note that GP was talking about Germany with seeming no awareness that the situation is different in Switzerland, France, England and Spain…

As a Czech person I have never npticed language barriers reducing travel (or business), if anything they increase it by making it more exciting.

Re: In Europe, trains are full, and more are on the way

#40

Post by cassepipe »

k__ wrote: post #3

Trains are pretty awesome, especially in small Europe. Flying always comes with security hassle. A train is just: get in/get out. If Europe would just spent more money on infrastructure. We have trains in Germany that can do 350km/h but I've yet to ride one that goes faster than 200, probably because the rails aren't what they're used to be. Then we have the Germany Ticket. A 50€/month subscription to all regional tr…

Aren't plane just as often late ?

My hypothesis is that planes are just as often late but people complain less because :

    1. They have already taken the whole day because getting to the airport, booking, security... so they don't care as much about a two hours delay.

    2. They have some respect for the fact that we are allow to fly and see that as big technical challenge depending on weather and good security practices. On the other hand a train *seems* trivial when in reality it's not. Psychologically for most people it's just putting some cars on rails and it will basically drive itslef to its destination.
Post reply on HN