Are there good candidates who don't have github etc?
They must exist. How do you avoid missing them?
The difference between a programmer & a hacker
31–40 of 62 posts
Re: The difference between a programmer & a hacker
#32This bothers me. I consider myself very passionate about programming - I think most people who know me would consider me to be a hacker. That said, I work for a company that does not allow its code to be open-sourced. The job is demanding and after I put in 60+ hours a week, I simply feel worn out. On top of that, I have an 8 month old son which means that my sleep is fragmented at the best of times. If you're unwill…
I think what the OP is trying to convey is that, passionate people leave external residue of their passion. Which I think is true. Do you have anything (code, scripts, blogs) to show (stuff which you worked on) when you worked at a different place?
On a different note, 60+ hours a week sounds too much, not sure when you started working on this job, but if you keep continuing that. You. Will. Burnout.
Re: The difference between a programmer & a hacker
#33"You can't fake passion" Honestly though, this gives a decent three step template for how to get yourself on the top of the pile in about ~1-5h worth of work: 1. Register a GitHub account, fork some projects that look cool 2. Register a domain, set up a yourname.github.com page for hosting, and add your contact info and link to github, whatever. Set up a mail redirector. 3. Upload your own project. If you don't have…
Guys who can do the things mentioned above are definitely hirable in 80% of dev jobs. They know how to solve problems, they don't have to be original.
Re: The difference between a programmer & a hacker
#34Increasingly, I'm thinking that "show us your GitHub" is a good filter for companies or recruiters I don't care to work for or with, but then perhaps I'm not the target market; I've been doing this for a while, I'm not a shiny new graduate. When I've interviewed people in the past, I've had them do some coding or domain modelling / OO design exercise as a phone screen. On the other side, companies I've interviewed wi…
The companies which ask you for 'your github profile', really want to see your code. When, people are passionate, they do things outside work. This article on Feynman is relevant: http://www.physics.ohio-state.edu/~kilcup/262/feynman.html?r...
If you are passionate about football, do you play football? or atleast watch others play football? That's definitely not your work. Why do you do it then?
Re: The difference between a programmer & a hacker
#35This bothers me. I consider myself very passionate about programming - I think most people who know me would consider me to be a hacker. That said, I work for a company that does not allow its code to be open-sourced. The job is demanding and after I put in 60+ hours a week, I simply feel worn out. On top of that, I have an 8 month old son which means that my sleep is fragmented at the best of times. If you're unwill…
I think what the OP is trying to convey is that, passionate people leave external residue of their passion. Which I think is true. Do you have anything (code, scripts, blogs) to show (stuff which you worked on) when you worked at a different place? On a different note, 60+ hours a week sounds too much, not sure when you started working on this job, but if you keep continuing that. You. Will. Burnout.
Been 7 years, been burned out for nearly 6. ;) And I've been here since I've graduated university in 2005.
And to answer the next question: it's a bank. Every time I've contemplated leaving, there was some major life-changing event that prevented me from doing so (i.e. getting married, wife losing her job, buying a house, moving abroad, having a kid...). Likely I'm making some excuses here, but my point remains: I know a lot of hard-working hackers that simply don't have the time to build a decent GitHub profile.
Those hackers - whom I work with - all read HN extensively to stay abreast of trends, and toy around with side-projects. But all that "side coding" happens whilst at work. And therein lies the problem. If you have ever worked as a programmer on Wall St. you won't need me to spell it out for you, but for those who haven't: your firm owns your intellectual property. Even if it's not related to the firm's business, if you do that work on the firm's premises, it is theirs, and you are not entitled to export it. If you try it is generally considered as grounds for termination.
Re: The difference between a programmer & a hacker
#36Increasingly, I'm thinking that "show us your GitHub" is a good filter for companies or recruiters I don't care to work for or with, but then perhaps I'm not the target market; I've been doing this for a while, I'm not a shiny new graduate. When I've interviewed people in the past, I've had them do some coding or domain modelling / OO design exercise as a phone screen. On the other side, companies I've interviewed wi…
The companies which ask you for 'your github profile', really want to see your code. When, people are passionate, they do things outside work . This article on Feynman is relevant: http://www.physics.ohio-state.edu/~kilcup/262/feynman.html?r... If you are passionate about football, do you play football? or atleast watch others play football? That's definitely not your work . Why do you do it then?
Um, no, they don't. They're desperately trying to find a proxy for "is a good hire" without spending a lot of time on it. GitHub is just the latest in a long line of such.
I have some sympathy with them; recruiting is hard, vital to get "right", and susceptible to gaming by unscrupulous individuals. It's also hard to get rid of people once they're in (at least in the UK). However, this is WHY you have to spend a lot of time on it. There are no shortcuts. Adding another checkbox "Has GitHub account with code in it" to the process is futile. You know, it won't surprise me to see "faked" accounts with lots of (scripted) commits showing up. Easy to do. Or better, I'll sell you a convincing looking repository with some code and a cheat-sheet of what to say when asked about it at interview. Hey, cool new startup idea!
Re: The difference between a programmer & a hacker
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
I think what the OP is trying to convey is that, passionate people leave external residue of their passion. Which I think is true. Do you have anything (code, scripts, blogs) to show (stuff which you worked on) when you worked at a different place? On a different note, 60+ hours a week sounds too much, not sure when you started working on this job, but if you keep continuing that. You. Will. Burnout.
Been 7 years, been burned out for nearly 6. ;) And I've been here since I've graduated university in 2005. And to answer the next question: it's a bank. Every time I've contemplated leaving, there was some major life-changing event that prevented me from doing so (i.e. getting married, wife losing her job, buying a house, moving abroad, having a kid...). Likely I'm making some excuses here, but my point remains: I kn…
It's not just Wall St. Everywhere I've worked has had similar clauses (even though some of them are of dubious legal stature in the UK).
Re: The difference between a programmer & a hacker
#38Earlier quoted context omitted.
The companies which ask you for 'your github profile', really want to see your code. When, people are passionate, they do things outside work . This article on Feynman is relevant: http://www.physics.ohio-state.edu/~kilcup/262/feynman.html?r... If you are passionate about football, do you play football? or atleast watch others play football? That's definitely not your work . Why do you do it then?
Um, no, they don't. They're desperately trying to find a proxy for "is a good hire" without spending a lot of time on it. GitHub is just the latest in a long line of such. I have some sympathy with them; recruiting is hard, vital to get "right", and susceptible to gaming by unscrupulous individuals. It's also hard to get rid of people once they're in (at least in the UK). However, this is WHY you have to spend a lot…
I think the OP says, it is one of the first filters, which I think is a good one. This is definitely no substitute for a thorough interview.
Re: The difference between a programmer & a hacker
#39I'm a junior level web developer in my first year at a salary job for such. I'm self taught and motivated, with a good CV and lots of completed projects under my belt.
Now it's become obvious my work has a serious visibility problem. Still pulling less-than-average wages, I asked my employer for a performance review which resulted in above average praise. Naturally I'm curious about the difference between my work and a Real Developer. They explained that a a web developer is dedicated with more experience on real projects etc, but reading between the lines it seemed like a perception that I've yet to pay my dues with long hours spent in frustration testing on overdue deliverables. So I understand that resentment, who do I think I am to walk in and demand wages consummate with my output? This is a communication problem. My abilities might mirror my peers, but reputation is effecting my career directly. At this point I realize most of my work is invisible, patching broken websites and refactoring old code, deploying small changes etc.
I need more visibility, I need to show off my skills and process more. I'm out of time and energy, my private projects at home are my own and I'd like to keep them private (for now). Now I'm working with my marketing person to setup a company development blog, hopefully that will give me more control over my image with this company.
Re: The difference between a programmer & a hacker
#40This bothers me. I consider myself very passionate about programming - I think most people who know me would consider me to be a hacker. That said, I work for a company that does not allow its code to be open-sourced. The job is demanding and after I put in 60+ hours a week, I simply feel worn out. On top of that, I have an 8 month old son which means that my sleep is fragmented at the best of times. If you're unwill…
Most start up companies have open source at the core of their philosophy, so it naturally follows that people working at such companies will have a rich open source portfolio. For instance, today I contributed a fix to a plugin we're using. Making open source contributions is just part of my normal workflow.
If you are working at a company that doesn't value open source now, and you don't contribute to open source, it will be hard to transition to a job that does value open source contributions.
You mention your current job is in banking. If you were to apply to another banking job, you'd probably have a better chance of getting the position than someone who has a rich open source portfolio, but no experience in the industry.
Having a GitHub account with x projects is just the new has x years of experience in Java.