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Apple to halt Apple Watch Series 9 and Ultra 2 sales in the US this week

9to5mac.com

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Re: Apple to halt Apple Watch Series 9 and Ultra 2 sales in the US this week

#31

Post by lamontcg »

vGPU wrote: post #9
llm_nerd wrote: post #2

Initially I presumed this was a patent troll sitting on something obvious and trying to extort a big player. Reading about the actual story reveals a very different situation, and it's one in which Apple needs to pay an extremely heavy toll for scumbag behaviour. https://www.latimes.com/business/technology/story/2023-10-05... Apple did precisely the sorts of things that big companies are reviled for, and the only goo…

Nor is Apple copying their tech the “kiss of death” that the article mentions, as Masimo makes primarily medical/hospital equipment. The majority of their equipment is sold to other businesses or through medical suppliers. Seeing as how they claim to own 90% of the hospital O2 monitoring market, I think they’re doing just fine. Once again, this isn’t Apple stealing tech from Joe Shmoe. This is just standard legalisti…

> Once again, this isn’t Apple stealing tech from Joe Shmoe. This is just standard legalistic BigCorp infighting, corporate backstabbing, brain drain/theft, etc.

Conversely, if Apple feels comfortable stealing from BigCorp, they will absolutely feel comfortable stealing from Joe Shmoe, which is why this issue should be treated seriously.

Apple needs to be incentivized so that if they're sitting down with a startup and considering if they should acquire and make the founder a VP or just go about stealing the technology that they should pick the former path because they've gotten burned in the past by doing the latter.

Re: Apple to halt Apple Watch Series 9 and Ultra 2 sales in the US this week

#32

Post by whycome »

Samsung phones (Note 8?) had a pulse oximeter that was downgraded via software updates (you could still access if installing an older APK). I wonder if it was in response to something similar. And, could Apple have similarly complied with a simple software change?

Re: Apple to halt Apple Watch Series 9 and Ultra 2 sales in the US this week

#33

Post by canucker2016 »

from a couple of months ago, https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2023/10/apple-watch-faci...:

"The ITC's ruling upholds a January ruling that found that the Apple Watch infringed on a Masimo patent. The exclusion period recommended on Thursday is supposed to go into effect after 60 days, during which time President Joe Biden can overturn the ruling. Biden previously declined to veto an ITC ruling that found the Apple Watch violated patents of a different company, AliveCor."

"Masimo has accused Apple of entering discussions with it for a potential partnership, including a potential acquisition, in 2013, only to steal Masimo's idea and poach some of Masimo's engineers to implement it."

"As noted by Reuters, Apple and Masimo's legal battles are ongoing. In May, Masimo's lawsuit against Apple in California federal court ended in a mistrial, and Apple has also sued Masimo in Delaware. Flipping the script, Apple has accused [PDF] Masimo's W1 smartwatches of violating Apple Watch patents."

"Meanwhile, Apple is also in an Apple Watch patent battle with California-based AliveCor. AliveCor is currently appealing the revocation of three patents that it claims the Apple Watch infringes upon. Before then, the ITC ruled that the Apple Watch infringes [PDF] on electrocardiogram sensor-related patents. But there's no import ban in effect because the US Patent and Trademark Office revoked the patents in question. Like Masimo, AliveCor has accused Apple of initiating a potential partnership but ultimately poaching AliveCor workers and infringing on its patents instead."

Looks like the patent lawyers are going to do well...

Re: Apple to halt Apple Watch Series 9 and Ultra 2 sales in the US this week

#35

Post by tadfisher »

kstrauser wrote: post #28
llm_nerd wrote: post #2

Initially I presumed this was a patent troll sitting on something obvious and trying to extort a big player. Reading about the actual story reveals a very different situation, and it's one in which Apple needs to pay an extremely heavy toll for scumbag behaviour. https://www.latimes.com/business/technology/story/2023-10-05... Apple did precisely the sorts of things that big companies are reviled for, and the only goo…

Alternatively, someone at Apple thought "we should add one of those pulse ox thingies like they've used in the doctor's office for the last 50 years into our next watch", saw that Masimo was a player in the space, met with them, and then decided they'd rather do it themselves. This is not something Masimo invented themselves. The class of devices existed for decades before Masimo even existed. I'm not saying that App…

> met with them, and then decided they'd rather do it themselves

..., headhunted Masimo engineers, and hired them to reimplement a pulse-ox device.

> Masimo and Apple began their relationship in 2013, when Apple discussed potentially integrating Masimo’s sensing technology into future Apple products. Internally, Apple executives debated the idea of buying Masimo and making its chief executive a vice president, according to documents made public at a later trial. But Apple ultimately decided against it because “acquisitions of this size aren’t our style,” an email reads.

> Instead of buying Masimo, Apple ended up hiring Masimo engineers and began working on the technology itself, Masimo later said.

https://www.wsj.com/tech/apple-to-halt-watch-sales-as-it-pre...

Re: Apple to halt Apple Watch Series 9 and Ultra 2 sales in the US this week

#38

Post by neilv »

This seems to be great marketing.

https://9to5mac.com/2023/12/18/apple-halting-apple-watch-ser...

> In a statement to 9to5Mac, Apple has announced that it will soon halt sales of its flagship Apple Watch models in the United States.

> The Apple Watch Series 9 and Apple Watch Ultra 2 will no longer be available to purchase from Apple starting later this week.

And https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/18/tech/apple-halt-sales-apple-w... cleverly paired the story with a file photo of people lining up outside an Apple Store.

> The company confirmed to CNN it will no longer be selling its Apple Watch Series 9 and Apple Watch Ultra 2, starting Thursday on Apple.com and from retail locations after December 24.

Get more people captive shoppers in their brick&morder stores during the shopping frenzy.

> In October, the International Trade Commission ruled that Apple was in violation of Masimo’s pulse oximeter patent, which uses light-based technology to read blood-oxygen levels. President Biden has 60 days to review the ruling before a ban could go into effect.

> “While the review period will not end until December 25, Apple is preemptively taking steps to comply should the ruling stand,” the company said in a statement.

It's nice for review of the ruling to drag its feet until after the Christmas shopping period.

With the news hype, Apple might even come out ahead?

Re: Apple to halt Apple Watch Series 9 and Ultra 2 sales in the US this week

#39

Post by lukev »

Why would Apple take their devices off the market or disable the feature instead of parting with a minuscule fraction of the pile of gold they're sitting on for a patent license?

I mean obviously for now it makes more sense for them to wait and hope they win on appeal or get the import ban veto'd, but if it actually comes down to not being able to sell the device, surely the lost revenue would exceed the licensing cost?

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