How China is tearing down Islam – FT • Hacker News Board

Re: How China is tearing down Islam – FT

#31

Post by thsksbd » Fri, Dec 01, 2023, 7:04 PM UTC

discard129 wrote: post #22

Leary wrote: post #17

[flagged]

The article also documents that they are banning young people from attending religious services. The article seems to be documenting practices designed to remove Islamic symbols and stop it from being transmitted to a younger generation. Tearing down Islam seems as good a description as any for that. I think you’ll need to explain why you think this is connected to Palestine in some way. The practices documented in t…

Not OP, but Ill take a stab at it (not an endorsement, just an explanation):

While FT is hyperventilating over China, calling it an erasure of Islam there has been scant coverage that during the current conflict in the Levant, one of the two belligerent has destroyed millenarian places of worship of many various faiths. Also, said belligerent has a sizable, growing, and politically very powerful minority that wants to blow up the third most holy place of worship for the other belligerent's faith and build a temple for themselves in top.

Again, not the OP and I don't particularly care much about the ME.

Re: How China is tearing down Islam – FT

#32

Post by woooooo » Fri, Dec 01, 2023, 7:06 PM UTC

discard129 wrote: post #27

woooooo wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

This makes no sense. You might want to try rewriting it.

Consider:

1. The actions of the US and allies towards Muslims the last few decades and/or weeks.

2. This bleeding heart article.

I'm just squaring the circle.

Re: How China is tearing down Islam – FT

#33

Post by user12344321 » Fri, Dec 01, 2023, 7:07 PM UTC

jimbob45 wrote: post #5

Which is weird because China-Iranian relations seem to be pretty strong atm[0]. I guess Iran looks the other way when China eradicates their own Muslims and China looks the other way when Iran eradicates their own Taoists/Buddhists? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China%E2%80%93Iran_relations

[flagged]

Re: How China is tearing down Islam – FT

#34

Post by candiodari » Fri, Dec 01, 2023, 7:17 PM UTC

boeingUH60 wrote: post #25

The Chinese government detests religion in general, so it's quite weird to single out Islam here. In a pseudo-communist country, the only god is the state and leader Xi Jinping is the chosen prophet.

This probably didn't help:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terrorism_in_China

Re: How China is tearing down Islam – FT

#35

Post by eesmith » Fri, Dec 01, 2023, 7:19 PM UTC

abletonlive wrote: post #12

jnovek wrote: post #8

Five years ago I would’ve never guessed that I would be downvoting overtly Islamophobic comments on HN. The current escalation reminds me of the early days after 9/11.

[flagged]

The traditional terms for "catholicphobic" inlude "anti-Catholic", "anti-papist", and "anti-clerical".

Take https://www.monticello.org/research-education/for-scholars/i... as an example:

"Thomas Jefferson’s well known anti-clericalism is generally treated as part of his advocacy for intellectual freedom, but it is also a sign of his participation in a much broader culture of anti-popery. Evan Haefeli will set Jefferson’s much lauded hope that America would “be to the world . . . the signal of arousing men to burst the chains under which monkish ignorance and superstition had persuaded them to bind themselves,” within a longstanding anti-popish tradition that contrasted liberty, knowledge, and science with stereotypes usually associated with Roman Catholicism. More than just anti-Catholic prejudice, the religious and political values derived from this tradition fused had been a fundamental part of how British Americans understood their liberty."

The US had an anti-Catholic tradition up until at least the 1960s, which JFK had to address directly in his presidential election campaign.

Just because we say "physics" instead of "physicology" doesn't mean it's not the same as other -ologies.

Re: How China is tearing down Islam – FT

#36

Post by Gibbon1 » Fri, Dec 01, 2023, 7:43 PM UTC

selimthegrim wrote: post #10

jimbob45 wrote: post #5

Which is weird because China-Iranian relations seem to be pretty strong atm[0]. I guess Iran looks the other way when China eradicates their own Muslims and China looks the other way when Iran eradicates their own Taoists/Buddhists? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China%E2%80%93Iran_relations

The Uyghurs are not Shiites.

And they aren't Arabs either.

Re: How China is tearing down Islam – FT

#37

Post by Always_Anon » Fri, Dec 01, 2023, 9:13 PM UTC

jnovek wrote: post #8

Five years ago I would’ve never guessed that I would be downvoting overtly Islamophobic comments on HN. The current escalation reminds me of the early days after 9/11.

>overtly Islamophobic comment

Being against those who support anti-woman and anti-LGBTQ+ views isn't Islamophobic. It's common fucking sense.

Re: How China is tearing down Islam – FT

#38

Post by Morte42 » Fri, Dec 01, 2023, 9:38 PM UTC

jimbob45 wrote: post #5

Which is weird because China-Iranian relations seem to be pretty strong atm[0]. I guess Iran looks the other way when China eradicates their own Muslims and China looks the other way when Iran eradicates their own Taoists/Buddhists? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China%E2%80%93Iran_relations

Iran has also rebuilt its own mosques with Persian design cues. In fact there is no single Islamic style anymore.

At one time mosques were like outposts that advertised the religion so they had to be built to be identifiable to strangers and mosques everywhere had a largely Arab design language. But given that these mosques were quickly erected they often needed repair and the differences in climate, culture and available building materials as well as advancing knowledge of construction techniques meant that parts of the mosque were modified.

There are only two structures in Islam that can't be modified, everything else just needs to serve the function of hosting a large group of people in accordance with local safety regulations. Yes, really. That's it. Most mosques are formerly abandoned buildings that look like warehouses. The holiest site in Islam is a simple cube. There is no specific shape or pattern you need to use to call it a mosque.

FT has been on a crusade to divide Muslims and the Chinese for a while now which is why they are upset about the shape of mosques in China but okay with Muslims dying everywhere else, this article is terrible even by their very low standards. These are all completely valid mosques.

Re: How China is tearing down Islam – FT

#39

Post by morninglight » Fri, Dec 01, 2023, 9:54 PM UTC

CharlieDigital wrote: post #9

jimbob45 wrote: post #5

Which is weird because China-Iranian relations seem to be pretty strong atm[0]. I guess Iran looks the other way when China eradicates their own Muslims and China looks the other way when Iran eradicates their own Taoists/Buddhists? [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China%E2%80%93Iran_relations

The Iranian government is about as Islamic as the Chinese government is Communist. Both countries simply have a ruling class that is using an ideology to wield control.

They have over a thousand years of European and American religious history to study for inspiration.

Re: How China is tearing down Islam – FT

#40

Post by syspec » Sat, Dec 02, 2023, 12:14 AM UTC

From the article, a printout of a municipal declaration posted at a school: > Why minors cannot enter religious venues > An open letter to parents and guardians of elementary and middle-school students in the entire city > Minors are at a critical stage of physical and mental development…they do not have the ability to think independently… therefore, please could all parents and friends actively cooperate and keep minors far from religion. ----- It actually seems logical to me!