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Gang crisis shaking Sweden

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Re: Gang crisis shaking Sweden

#31

Post by romafirst3 »

slaw wrote: post #25
romafirst3 wrote: post #10

While this does indeed sound like a problem for Sweden and something they will have to fix, it's worth pointing out that by my calculation the US fatal assault by fire arm rate is 12X the rate that is causing a crisis in Sweden.

Could you share your calculation? Did you include suicides that are 2/3 of gun deaths in the US?

14.6 firearm deaths per 100,000 (146 per million) , about 54% suicide, 43% murders (the rest accidental and law enforcement). Comes out to about 62 deaths per million, rate here is about 5.5 so 62 / 5.5 = 11.27X

Source (https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/04/26/what-the-...)

Re: Gang crisis shaking Sweden

#32

Post by romafirst3 »

Throwfi44 wrote: post #20
romafirst3 wrote: post #10

While this does indeed sound like a problem for Sweden and something they will have to fix, it's worth pointing out that by my calculation the US fatal assault by fire arm rate is 12X the rate that is causing a crisis in Sweden.

> fire arm rate is 12X Add explosives, hand grenades, kidnapping... US does not have a big problem with organized crime!

this is one of those statements that is too ambiguous for the internet. It's hard to know if you are being sarcastic? Attempting satire? Or you are trying to make a joke, or genuinely don't know what you are talking about. So, can you clarify?

Re: Gang crisis shaking Sweden

#33

Post by xcv123 »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #28
xcv123 wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their argument is that the left wing side are responsible, and are incorrectly blaming social factors other than the mass immigration of third world refugees who are now creating a gang ridden hellscape in parts of Sweden, emulating their original homelands. That is not begging the question.

It is if you don't demonstrate the connection/causality.

Obviously the gangs are made up of those immigrants, not native ethnic Swedish people. With the assumption that all sides are painfully aware of that, the connection/causality is being demonstrated very clearly in Sweden today. That's what the article is showing. The argument is that the left side is being disingenuous.

Re: Gang crisis shaking Sweden

#34

Post by romafirst3 »

mrkeen wrote: post #30
tremon wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you provide a list of which parts of which towns are shady, so I can avoid them?

I moved - sorry, immigrated - to Stockholm end of 2016. At that time the sensationalist media was reporting on 'no-go zones' - parts of town that even the police were too afraid to go to. One night I was sitting on the subway when a guy came and sat down opposite a girl, and started telling her he was gonna go check out one of these 'no-go zones'. His destination was östermalm.

Sounds like an awful place.

From wikipedia.

"Elegant Östermalm is known for its smart bars and restaurants on Stureplan square, and its cultural venues, such as the Swedish History Museum, displaying Viking weapons. Designer boutiques dot the area near Östermalms Saluhall, a food market known for traditional specialties like gravlax and smoked shrimp. Centered on the imposing National Library of Sweden, tranquil Humlegården park hosts plays in summer."

Re: Gang crisis shaking Sweden

#35

Post by Throwfi44 »

romafirst3 wrote: post #32
Throwfi44 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> fire arm rate is 12X Add explosives, hand grenades, kidnapping... US does not have a big problem with organized crime!

this is one of those statements that is too ambiguous for the internet. It's hard to know if you are being sarcastic? Attempting satire? Or you are trying to make a joke, or genuinely don't know what you are talking about. So, can you clarify?

No I am serious, if you are comparing murders, you should include all weapons!

There are regional differences! Fire arms are heavily regulated and relatively hard to get in EU. We are close to war zones, hand grenades are easier to smuggle, and are used in Sweden.

If you include murders by knife, London is worse than US!

Edit: also you wrote "assault" that could include anything from armed robbery without health injury, to self defense. Apples and oranges!

Re: Gang crisis shaking Sweden

#36

Post by AnimalMuppet »

xcv123 wrote: post #33
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is if you don't demonstrate the connection/causality.

Obviously the gangs are made up of those immigrants, not native ethnic Swedish people. With the assumption that all sides are painfully aware of that, the connection/causality is being demonstrated very clearly in Sweden today. That's what the article is showing. The argument is that the left side is being disingenuous.

Well, all right, if you don't demonstrate the correlation, or if it hasn't already been demonstrated. I'm not in Sweden, so it may be "obvious" to those on the scene. But to those who don't know the situation, the one word claim of "obviously" isn't very convincing, either.

Are there any statistics on crime rates in Sweden, broken down by immigrant vs. native?

As I said, I'm not there, and I don't disbelieve you. But evidence is better than "obviously".

Re: Gang crisis shaking Sweden

#37

Post by xcv123 »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #36
xcv123 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously the gangs are made up of those immigrants, not native ethnic Swedish people. With the assumption that all sides are painfully aware of that, the connection/causality is being demonstrated very clearly in Sweden today. That's what the article is showing. The argument is that the left side is being disingenuous.

Well, all right, if you don't demonstrate the correlation, or if it hasn't already been demonstrated. I'm not in Sweden, so it may be "obvious" to those on the scene. But to those who don't know the situation, the one word claim of "obviously" isn't very convincing, either. Are there any statistics on crime rates in Sweden, broken down by immigrant vs. native? As I said, I'm not there, and I don't disbelieve you. But…

Sorry I thought it was obvious. This has been a massive ongoing problem in Sweden for years since they opened the borders to a mass wave of immigration from hellscape African/Middle Eastern parts of the world in the 2010's. It has been in the news regularly for the past few years. Bad people exploited their ridiculous policy (not genuine refugees, just criminals and psychopaths) and they accepted hundreds of thousands of people without a filter.

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/SWE/sweden/refugee-sta...

Re: Gang crisis shaking Sweden

#38

Post by [deleted] »

romafirst3 wrote: post #32
Throwfi44 wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> fire arm rate is 12X Add explosives, hand grenades, kidnapping... US does not have a big problem with organized crime!

this is one of those statements that is too ambiguous for the internet. It's hard to know if you are being sarcastic? Attempting satire? Or you are trying to make a joke, or genuinely don't know what you are talking about. So, can you clarify?

[deleted]

Re: Gang crisis shaking Sweden

#39

Post by AnimalMuppet »

xcv123 wrote: post #37
AnimalMuppet wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, all right, if you don't demonstrate the correlation, or if it hasn't already been demonstrated. I'm not in Sweden, so it may be "obvious" to those on the scene. But to those who don't know the situation, the one word claim of "obviously" isn't very convincing, either. Are there any statistics on crime rates in Sweden, broken down by immigrant vs. native? As I said, I'm not there, and I don't disbelieve you. But…

Sorry I thought it was obvious. This has been a massive ongoing problem in Sweden for years since they opened the borders to a mass wave of immigration from hellscape African/Middle Eastern parts of the world in the 2010's. It has been in the news regularly for the past few years. Bad people exploited their ridiculous policy (not genuine refugees, just criminals and psychopaths) and they accepted hundreds of thousand…

OK, that says that Sweden takes a lot of immigrants, but says nothing about crime.

But rather than just complain, I started looking, and I found https://www.researchgate.net/publication/338563093_Migrants_.... Which pretty much proves your point.

Re: Gang crisis shaking Sweden

#40

Post by xcv123 »

AnimalMuppet wrote: post #39
xcv123 wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry I thought it was obvious. This has been a massive ongoing problem in Sweden for years since they opened the borders to a mass wave of immigration from hellscape African/Middle Eastern parts of the world in the 2010's. It has been in the news regularly for the past few years. Bad people exploited their ridiculous policy (not genuine refugees, just criminals and psychopaths) and they accepted hundreds of thousand…

OK, that says that Sweden takes a lot of immigrants, but says nothing about crime. But rather than just complain, I started looking, and I found https://www.researchgate.net/publication/338563093_Migrants_... . Which pretty much proves your point.

Yes it is easy to find all of this. Huge embarrassment and deeply regretful for Sweden.

Criminals saw a weakness and exploited it as hard as possible.

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