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Automerge-Repo: A "batteries-included" toolkit for local-first applications

automerge.org

31–40 of 45 posts

Re: Automerge-Repo: A "batteries-included" toolkit for local-first applications

#31
Would Automerge be a good choice for a non-realtime single-user app that just needs to have reliable offline support?

E.g a personal note-taking app where the user will never have any collaborators, but where they expect the app to work fully offline on multiple devices and reliably sync up when they come online.

Re: Automerge-Repo: A "batteries-included" toolkit for local-first applications

#34
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ouch Peter. Massive offense taken. > In our research, we've found that editing is usually serial or asynchronous. Medium-to-large-size company with a town hall = many people editing a document at the same time. Workshop at a company or a university with a modest size classroom = many people editing a document at the same time. I can't tell you how many times our web-based collaborative code editors would fall over du…

Please accept my unreserved apologies, Heather! No offense is intended. I can speak for everyone working on Automerge when I say that we've very much appreciated Matthew's work and have indeed spent quite a lot of time studying and responding to it. We spoke about it in person last week, in fact. As for the use-cases, I do not mean to exclude live collaboration from consideration, just to note that it hasn't been our…

> We simply have slightly different goals in our work, which undoubtedly reflect where our engineering investments lie.

I’d love to hear more about this. Do you elaborate anywhere?

Re: Automerge-Repo: A "batteries-included" toolkit for local-first applications

#35

Congrats! Many moons ago the lack of undo/redo was the main blocker. Has this been added?

Robust undo/redo remains an ongoing research project. Leo Stewen's work was presented at PLF 2023 a few days ago. It turns out to be a subtle problem to really get completely right, but in my experience you can usually get passable results by letting editors default undo behaviour reverse text input.

For applications with more document-structured data, you can now produce inverse patches using Automerge.diff to go between any two points. To implement a reasonable undo in this environment you can record whatever document heads you consider useful undo points and then patch between them.

To perhaps expand on why the problem remains unsolved slightly further, there was a robust discussion about what the expected behaviour of "undo" out to be in even simple cases at the conference.

Re: Automerge-Repo: A "batteries-included" toolkit for local-first applications

#37

This is exciting in several ways including the fact that Martin Kleppmann is involved with the project. Filed at the top of my reading list if nothing else to see an undoubtedly good example of a complex Rust project.

Author of Designing Data-Intensive Applications book. It is such a well-written book, reading it right now, and cannot recommend enough.

Re: Automerge-Repo: A "batteries-included" toolkit for local-first applications

#39
post #33

So is it like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Wave - but with limited scope and with new algos and finally usable?

Google Docs is the spiritual successor to Wave, and has been usable for quite some time.

Spiritual predecessor - it was released 3 years before Wave :)

Re: Automerge-Repo: A "batteries-included" toolkit for local-first applications

#40

Would Automerge be a good choice for a non-realtime single-user app that just needs to have reliable offline support? E.g a personal note-taking app where the user will never have any collaborators, but where they expect the app to work fully offline on multiple devices and reliably sync up when they come online.

Yes, it's a great fit for this. You would probably want an internet-accessable sync server with a copy of the repo, so that the data is still available when no peers are online. Bluetooth/uPnP network adapters would be the cherry on top but AFAIK aren't ready yet.
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