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Snoop unto them as they snoop unto you

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Re: Snoop unto them as they snoop unto you

#31

Post by genman »

throw10920 wrote: post #21
hightrix wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Many speed limits are set lower than they need to be. On many roads, including freeways, the average speed of traffic is higher than the speed limit. Driving the speed limit on these freeways is dangerous. Additionally, many speedometers read slightly higher than the actual speed. Driving the exact speed limit on many roads as shown by your speedometer means you are actually driving quite slow. Repecting the spe…

> Many speed limits are set lower than they need to be. ...the only correct response to which is to contact the state government and complain while continuing to respect the law. Breaking the law while remaining silent is diametrically opposed to the democratic system that the US, at least, aspires to. > need to be ...oh, and vehicle inefficiency increases superlinearly with speed[1]. Until the majority of the vehicl…

Actually not accepting the given speed limit is a form of voting against said speed limit (especially when done en masse). Yes, it is not formal, but it is voting nonetheless. If the system was really democratic and not tyrannical then it would take it into account and would not resort to more control and punishment.

Re: Snoop unto them as they snoop unto you

#32

Post by Arrath »

genman wrote: post #28
pesfandiar wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd argue speeding is even worse, but to each their own.

I would argue that general population disagrees with this. +/- 20% tolerance is completely acceptable.

Much like Doctors having a rather different definition of 'binge drinking' or 'heavy drinking' than most of the public, general (dis)agreement may not mean terribly much in the end.

Re: Snoop unto them as they snoop unto you

#33

Post by genman »

Arrath wrote: post #32
genman wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would argue that general population disagrees with this. +/- 20% tolerance is completely acceptable.

Much like Doctors having a rather different definition of 'binge drinking' or 'heavy drinking' than most of the public, general (dis)agreement may not mean terribly much in the end.

Quite the opposite. Doctors can think what ever they want until some kind of social behavior in generally accepted by the society. Any amount of alcohol is bad and likewise any travel is dangerous. It's only about acceptable degree.

Re: Snoop unto them as they snoop unto you

#34

Post by nickpeterson »

genman wrote: post #31
throw10920 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Many speed limits are set lower than they need to be. ...the only correct response to which is to contact the state government and complain while continuing to respect the law. Breaking the law while remaining silent is diametrically opposed to the democratic system that the US, at least, aspires to. > need to be ...oh, and vehicle inefficiency increases superlinearly with speed[1]. Until the majority of the vehicl…

Actually not accepting the given speed limit is a form of voting against said speed limit (especially when done en masse). Yes, it is not formal, but it is voting nonetheless. If the system was really democratic and not tyrannical then it would take it into account and would not resort to more control and punishment.

I guess I’ve always viewed it from the standpoint of, at what speed are crashes rarer and most survivable (do those even coincide?) I think a lot of people really overestimate the difference highway speed makes in their overall transit time. If everyone going 55 led to far fewer fatalities, better fuel economy, and less delays because of accidents, I’d imagine we’d do it already.

Re: Snoop unto them as they snoop unto you

#36

Post by etrautmann »

chatmasta wrote: post #23
jbaber wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to think this before I moved to the Eastern seabord of the US. Many freeways have the speed limits randomly oscillate to values ranging from 50 to 75 with the flow of traffic pretending the speed limit is always 65. There are definitely speed traps set up in many unexpected 55 zones which I only know to slow down at from familiarity.

But this doesn't invalidate the OP's point... regardless of how reasonable you believe a change in speed limit to be, you're still obligated to follow it, and if you don't then you might get a ticket. And it's not like these changes are unannounced; there is a sign for every time it changes. Surely if you're going to listen to some "speed trap detecting" contraption, you could also look at the signs that announce the…

The argument is not that the law isn’t technically followable. The argument is that the law is not based on safety and is capricious and designed to catch and fine people, which could justify ways of avoiding getting caught.

Re: Snoop unto them as they snoop unto you

#38

Post by abathur »

pesfandiar wrote: post #25
freitzkriesler2 wrote: post #2

I always wanted something to watch where their unmarked cars are. Speed traps are the worst.

I'd argue speeding is even worse, but to each their own.

Anecdata, but I regularly see people exceed the speed limit by 30mph in Houston without much intervention by police.

The city has (imo) a psychotic driving culture, but is still roughly middle-of-the-road in us news and world report's ranking of most dangerous US cities to drive in.

Large speed deltas are (conjecture I haven't bothered to research) probably unsafe under any conditions. Exceeding safe speeds for the conditions is obviously dangerous, but the size and design of the road and it's lanes are some of those conditions.

I don't particularly care which, but in order to minimize speed deltas I do think it should be incumbent on the state to either set low speed limits and fastidiously police them or else set speed limits that are close to the natural speeds a given road supports to cut down the gap between people who drive the road as it feels and those who drive the signage.

Re: Snoop unto them as they snoop unto you

#39

Post by jack_pp »

chatmasta wrote: post #23
jbaber wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to think this before I moved to the Eastern seabord of the US. Many freeways have the speed limits randomly oscillate to values ranging from 50 to 75 with the flow of traffic pretending the speed limit is always 65. There are definitely speed traps set up in many unexpected 55 zones which I only know to slow down at from familiarity.

But this doesn't invalidate the OP's point... regardless of how reasonable you believe a change in speed limit to be, you're still obligated to follow it, and if you don't then you might get a ticket. And it's not like these changes are unannounced; there is a sign for every time it changes. Surely if you're going to listen to some "speed trap detecting" contraption, you could also look at the signs that announce the…

Just because the system works in a certain way doesn't mean it's working correctly.

I could get a ticket for jaywalking a red light even though it's 4am, dead silent and can't see a car for a mile. "The law is the law", if some traffic cop came from around the corner he could ticket me. Now is that right? I think it isn't. Now what are my options? Spend an inordinate amount of time trying to change the way society works or figure out ways to go about my life without having to obey some over-bearing public official's rules.

Re: Snoop unto them as they snoop unto you

#40

Post by jack_pp »

grecy wrote: post #26
hightrix wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes. Many speed limits are set lower than they need to be. On many roads, including freeways, the average speed of traffic is higher than the speed limit. Driving the speed limit on these freeways is dangerous. Additionally, many speedometers read slightly higher than the actual speed. Driving the exact speed limit on many roads as shown by your speedometer means you are actually driving quite slow. Repecting the spe…

> Many speed limits are set lower than they need to be. Sounds like you are a qualified expert and know more about road design, traffic flow and pedestrian safety than those doing the job now. Clearly you need to apply for a position so you can right these so obvious wrongs. Please, don’t pretend you can do the job better than qualified experts

Can you give proof that these limits are set by "experts", what makes them experts? What are their qualifications?
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