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Judeo-Christian roots will ensure US military AI is used ethically, general says

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Re: Judeo-Christian roots will ensure US military AI is used ethically, general says

#31

Post by mighmi »

FooBarBizBazz wrote: post #21
CodeAndCuffs wrote: post #6

What does that even mean?! Will this take the Christian path of forgiving our enemies, turning the other cheek, and giving our shirts to people who steal our cloaks? Is he saying that military AI should specifically target Philistines and the uncircumcised? Will the military AI enslave people but give them the option of freedom or permanent servitude after 7 years? You can't base something on Judeo-Christian ethics b…

This phrase leaves out the largest branch of the Abrahamic family tree, namely Islam. It also underplays the revolution that was Christianity.

> largest branch of the Abrahamic family tree, namely Islam

The number of all Muslims only surpassed members of the Catholic church around 2008. There are still substantially more Christians as a whole, including Orthodox and Protestants. https://www.nbcnews.com/id/wbna23885015

Based on current population growth, in the next 10 years, there should be more Muslims than Christians. From wikipedia's chart: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muslim_population_growth#Histo... - 1970: 577mm - 2000: 1.291b - 2013: 1.635b - 2016: 1.8b - 2020: 2b

For comparison, the Catholic church currently has 1.36b members, and Christians overall are estimated at 2.3 billion.

Re: Judeo-Christian roots will ensure US military AI is used ethically, general says

#32

Post by haswell »

When people talk about the existential threat of AI, stories like this are the reason I find those risks worth taking seriously.

Judeo-Christian roots are good for making exactly the wrong kinds of conclusions about the world. Set aside ethics for a moment; this worldview instills the belief that the world we live in was made, and that it is humanity’s right to exercise dominion over it. That when we screw things up badly enough, that’s actually a precursor to the greatest event in human history.

Explicit is the belief that the next world is the world that matters, and that this world is just a playground to establish what kind of people we are before we go to heaven or hell.

Implicit in this belief lies a fundamental ignorance of the intrinsic interconnection of phenomena, the sheer improbability of our existence, and an attitude that imagines us to be greater than the forces of nature. And once you mix in a side of anthropomorphizing AI, it’s frightening to think about the hubris involved in a statement claiming that ethics emerge from Judeo-Christian thinking.

As an atheist who was forced to study the Bible in my youth, the biggest thing I took away from the experience is that “Judeo-Christian thinking” has little to do with what Jesus taught. If it did, it’d be a pretty cool religion for the most part.

Instead, it stands in as a justification that people can apply to their existing beliefs. A mental crutch to bypass the need to expand one’s worldview. I’ve met some good Christians. But they’re not the kind of people who represent the average beliefs held by the community.

Re: Judeo-Christian roots will ensure US military AI is used ethically, general says

#34

Post by declan_roberts »

haswell wrote: post #32

When people talk about the existential threat of AI, stories like this are the reason I find those risks worth taking seriously. Judeo-Christian roots are good for making exactly the wrong kinds of conclusions about the world. Set aside ethics for a moment; this worldview instills the belief that the world we live in was made , and that it is humanity’s right to exercise dominion over it. That when we screw things up…

Those are some pretty interesting conclusions you’ve arrived at.

Re: Judeo-Christian roots will ensure US military AI is used ethically, general says

#35

Post by hdjjhhvvhga »

bko wrote: post #29
CodeAndCuffs wrote: post #6

What does that even mean?! Will this take the Christian path of forgiving our enemies, turning the other cheek, and giving our shirts to people who steal our cloaks? Is he saying that military AI should specifically target Philistines and the uncircumcised? Will the military AI enslave people but give them the option of freedom or permanent servitude after 7 years? You can't base something on Judeo-Christian ethics b…

I think you're overthinking it. I think he meant "Judaeo-Christian roots" as a kind of stand in for American exceptionalism that values individual liberties and freedom above all else. The country obviously doesn't always live up to that ideal, but that was the basic idea He says as much in the article: > “The foundation of my comments was to explain that the Air Force is not going to allow AI to take actions, nor ar…

On the contrary, this phrase needs clarification, because there is a fundamental difference between the Hebrew bible and the new testament.

A simple example Exodus 21:22-25 says:

"When men strive together and hit a pregnant woman, so that her children come out, but there is no harm, the one who hit her shall surely be fined, as the woman's husband shall impose on him, and he shall pay as the judges determine. But if there is harm, then you shall pay life for life, eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, burn for burn, wound for wound, stripe for stripe."

Jesus refers to it directly in Matthew 5:38-39:

"You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.’ But I say to you, Do not resist the one who is evil. But if anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also."

So it would be useful to know what values exactly the general had in mind.

Re: Judeo-Christian roots will ensure US military AI is used ethically, general says

#36

Post by [deleted] »

CodeAndCuffs wrote: post #6

What does that even mean?! Will this take the Christian path of forgiving our enemies, turning the other cheek, and giving our shirts to people who steal our cloaks? Is he saying that military AI should specifically target Philistines and the uncircumcised? Will the military AI enslave people but give them the option of freedom or permanent servitude after 7 years? You can't base something on Judeo-Christian ethics b…

[deleted]

Re: Judeo-Christian roots will ensure US military AI is used ethically, general says

#37

Post by hdjjhhvvhga »

FooBarBizBazz wrote: post #21
CodeAndCuffs wrote: post #6

What does that even mean?! Will this take the Christian path of forgiving our enemies, turning the other cheek, and giving our shirts to people who steal our cloaks? Is he saying that military AI should specifically target Philistines and the uncircumcised? Will the military AI enslave people but give them the option of freedom or permanent servitude after 7 years? You can't base something on Judeo-Christian ethics b…

This phrase leaves out the largest branch of the Abrahamic family tree, namely Islam. It also underplays the revolution that was Christianity.

That's because of the famous concept of Jihad and its interpretation over the ages until today. I bet of the general said, "We are going to train our military robots using Islamic values" that would definitely raise a lot of questions.

Re: Judeo-Christian roots will ensure US military AI is used ethically, general says

#38

Post by ben_w »

coldtea wrote: post #17
CodeAndCuffs wrote: post #6

What does that even mean?! Will this take the Christian path of forgiving our enemies, turning the other cheek, and giving our shirts to people who steal our cloaks? Is he saying that military AI should specifically target Philistines and the uncircumcised? Will the military AI enslave people but give them the option of freedom or permanent servitude after 7 years? You can't base something on Judeo-Christian ethics b…

> What does that even mean?! Will this take the Christian path of forgiving our enemies, turning the other cheek, and giving our shirts to people who steal our cloaks? No, he means more of the Old Testament variety of ethics.

Great, the AI will be making regular pilgrimages to the (no longer existent) Temple in Jerusalem to offer burned sacrifices.

Re: Judeo-Christian roots will ensure US military AI is used ethically, general says

#39

Post by [deleted] »

hdjjhhvvhga wrote: post #35
bko wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're overthinking it. I think he meant "Judaeo-Christian roots" as a kind of stand in for American exceptionalism that values individual liberties and freedom above all else. The country obviously doesn't always live up to that ideal, but that was the basic idea He says as much in the article: > “The foundation of my comments was to explain that the Air Force is not going to allow AI to take actions, nor ar…

On the contrary, this phrase needs clarification, because there is a fundamental difference between the Hebrew bible and the new testament. A simple example Exodus 21:22-25 says: "When men strive together and hit a pregnant woman, so that her children come out, but there is no harm, the one who hit her shall surely be fined, as the woman's husband shall impose on him, and he shall pay as the judges determine. But if…

[deleted]
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