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I have resigned from all roles in rustlang, effective immediately

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Re: I have resigned from all roles in rustlang, effective immediately

#31

Post by worik »

sergiotapia wrote: post #24

What is it about Rust that attracts so much drama like this? Someone has to do the calculus here. It can't be the sheer number of developers because Rust is still a niche language. Why does Rust have these kind of shenanigans and attract people that either cause these problems or experience these problems? The only other language that comes close is the V language, but that's mostly people shitting on the language (f…

> What is it about Rust that attracts so much drama like this?

Any group that aims for inclusivenes, and gets large has the problem. Individuals, especially bright motivated people often get frustrated and a proportion of them do not have the social skills and maturity to avoid tantrums

Re: I have resigned from all roles in rustlang, effective immediately

#32

Post by worik »

camdenlock wrote: post #29
sergiotapia wrote: post #24

What is it about Rust that attracts so much drama like this? Someone has to do the calculus here. It can't be the sheer number of developers because Rust is still a niche language. Why does Rust have these kind of shenanigans and attract people that either cause these problems or experience these problems? The only other language that comes close is the V language, but that's mostly people shitting on the language (f…

Terminally-online people behave like this, on average.

> Terminally-online people behave like this, on average.

No we do not. Do we?

Re: I have resigned from all roles in rustlang, effective immediately

#33

Post by jeroenhd »

daniel-thompson wrote: post #12
colejohnson66 wrote: post #2

Here's the reasoning, should the tweets get deleted: https://thephd.dev/i-am-no-longer-speaking-at-rustconf-2023

How does [person A choosing not to speak at a conference] connect to [person B leaving the Rust project]?

I can't find the direct link either, but the blog post is quoted as the reason for leaving the Rust project.

Neither happens in a vacuum. There was likely a lot of internet and real-life drama between people. The basis for the blog post already shows some sign of preexisting drama.

I don't know the context so I can only theorize why they quit.

Perhaps they noticed the drama beforehand and this was the final straw. Perhaps they felt called out by the blog post. Perhaps they saw more internet drama coming and decided they've had enough.

Maybe of note: JT has been very influential in a new language originating from the SerenityOS project, Jakt [1], though his contributions died off over time. Perhaps they're searching for a new challenge and saw this as a good moment to get out?

[1]: https://github.com/SerenityOS/jakt

Re: I have resigned from all roles in rustlang, effective immediately

#34

Post by nabakin »

rvz wrote: post #30

So someone getting upset over their powerpoint presentation getting downgraded from being part of the RustConf keynote. That’s it? Much like an explosion in an ant hill.

1. They didn't submit a talk or intend to give one

2. They were specifically invited to give a keynote and decided to do so at their request

3. Repeatedly confirmed the topic was ok

4. Put a lot of work into the keynote

5. Told last minute they would not be giving a keynote with no reason

I'd be upset. This is not how you treat your community.

Re: I have resigned from all roles in rustlang, effective immediately

#35

Post by [deleted] »

jcranmer wrote: post #27
WatchDog wrote: post #10

Resigning over someone else’s talk being bumped into a different slot? All seems overly dramatic.

My understanding (I've never had the mispleasure of running a conference) is that keynote talks are very different from regular talks. With regular talks, presenters submit talk proposals, the conference committee select which talks to give. With keynote talks, the committee instead asks a specific presenter to give a specific talk. So when someone, who is hesitant in the first place about the appropriateness of thei…

[deleted]

Re: I have resigned from all roles in rustlang, effective immediately

#36

Post by lo_zamoyski »

netaustin wrote: post #18
wk_end wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In no way defending the sloppy conference planning or how the former keynote speaker got screwed here, but...unless I'm missing something it seems pretty disproportionate to completely leave a community you've invested over seven years of your life in over sloppy conference planning, doesn't it? I feel like I'm missing something.

What you're describing may be the sunk cost fallacy [ https://thedecisionlab.com/biases/the-sunk-cost-fallacy ].

No. The sunk cost fallacy involves sticking with something you know is the worse option (sticking with that option is the worse option) by appealing to the investment already made in that option as a justification. It does not mean that all appeals to investment are fallacious. If I invested 5 years in graduate school, and I'm a few months away from receiving my doctorate, it would not be categorically fallacious to argue that since I've already invested this much time, I should stick it out even if I'm thinking of pivoting. You would be losing a degree for what could be a vanishingly small benefit of leaving.

In line with that, the comment above is asking for some reason that could explain why someone who has invested so much time in something would leave so abruptly. A person who has worked on a project for so long derives (and provides) many benefits for having been involved for so long, and even when people change course, they don't typically do so this abruptly without a proportional reason. Hence, the mystery.

Re: I have resigned from all roles in rustlang, effective immediately

#37

Post by abeyer »

LightHugger wrote: post #20

[flagged]

That seems the exact opposite of what the post author said, praising the foundation:

> The Rust Foundation has handled the grant work with utmost grace, respect, and professionalism for myself and Shepherd’s time. Contrarily, the Rust Project deigned to effectively pass several mandates down through an opaque process that affected me, while refusing to air to-this-minute unknown grievances with the direction of the Compile-Time Midterm Report.

Re: I have resigned from all roles in rustlang, effective immediately

#38

Post by camdenlock »

worik wrote: post #32
camdenlock wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Terminally-online people behave like this, on average.

> Terminally-online people behave like this, on average. No we do not. Do we?

If you don’t, you might not be online nearly enough.

Re: I have resigned from all roles in rustlang, effective immediately

#39

Post by jasmer »

dahdum wrote: post #21
wk_end wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In no way defending the sloppy conference planning or how the former keynote speaker got screwed here, but...unless I'm missing something it seems pretty disproportionate to completely leave a community you've invested over seven years of your life in over sloppy conference planning, doesn't it? I feel like I'm missing something.

They reached out to him to give a talk he wasn’t ready to do. He obliges, works to make it happen, and gets blindsided by organizational politics. If he feels the organization and leadership neither respect him personally or his efforts, it’s a perfectly proportionate response. Not sure how I’d react in his exact situation, but once trust and mutual respect are gone, so am I.

[flagged]

Re: I have resigned from all roles in rustlang, effective immediately

#40

Post by jasmer »

dom96 wrote: post #13
wk_end wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In no way defending the sloppy conference planning or how the former keynote speaker got screwed here, but...unless I'm missing something it seems pretty disproportionate to completely leave a community you've invested over seven years of your life in over sloppy conference planning, doesn't it? I feel like I'm missing something.

I really doubt this is the sole reason. It’s likely simply what broke the camel’s back so to speak.

Or it's one side of the story.
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