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How Can A Free Conference Call Be Free?

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Re: How Can A Free Conference Call Be Free?

#31

Post by adaml_623 »

noonespecial wrote: post #27
jballanc wrote: post #16

Bear with me here, but it seems to me like this is a good argument for socialism. Consider: why do termination fees exist? Clearly, as America was being wired with telephone service, the cost to run lines to rural areas was prohibitively expensive. So what's the capitalist/Randian thing to do? Well, charge more for phone service out there. If people can't afford it, then they'll move to where it is cheaper to have a…

Unfortunately, the cost of the government putting in those lines plus the cost of the inefficiency and corruption attached to government action still need to be paid. Which means the people have less money to buy the cheaper food. Not only is government money not free, it happens to be some of the most expensive and inefficient money available.

Is this a valid rebuttal of your point?

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/01/09/1053022/-Medicare-i...

Re: How Can A Free Conference Call Be Free?

#33

Post by burgerbrain »

andylei wrote: post #26
funkah wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And a libertarian would count this as yet another instance where government intervention causes problems. To a worm in horseradish, the world is horseradish.

i'm no libertarian, and i don't believe that every government intervention causes problems, but i don't understand why you think this is a case where government intervention did not cause problems.

I don't read his comment as actually stating his opinion on the matter, but if we assume he is a libertarian then it sounds like he certainly does think this is a case of government intervention causing problems.

Re: How Can A Free Conference Call Be Free?

#34

Post by noonespecial »

adaml_623 wrote: post #31
noonespecial wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately, the cost of the government putting in those lines plus the cost of the inefficiency and corruption attached to government action still need to be paid. Which means the people have less money to buy the cheaper food. Not only is government money not free, it happens to be some of the most expensive and inefficient money available.

Is this a valid rebuttal of your point? http://www.dailykos.com/story/2012/01/09/1053022/-Medicare-i...

Its not impossible that with even with all of the inefficiencies associated with government action that its still the best course of action. Things like hydroelectric dams and national interstate systems spring to mind.

It should however be the last resort. Its an extremely blunt instrument. Private sector vs government; To quote my favorite author: "Its the difference between using a feather and using a chicken."

Re: How Can A Free Conference Call Be Free?

#35

Post by shad0wfax »

Interesting, I dint know that.

I had an interesting experience with ATT. I was into the 6 month of a 2year contract back in 2007. I wasn't using my phone much (non-iphone). But then I went on a road trip to Yellowstone, which included driving through ND, SD, MT and WY. During this 7 day trip, I was using my phone a lot (work + personal). The total amount of minutes I spent in those 7 days were way more than my usual monthly usage (in fact it ate into my rollover minutes as well).

After a few days from returning, I received a letter from ATT telling me that they could not afford me on their network for using so many minutes, as they had to pay their partner n/w in those states (not just major cities in those states). They wanted me to leave their network, in return they would let me have the phone (under contract for free).

I was happy to oblige as I wanted an iphone. I switched to Tmobile for a week and then went back to ATT again (iphone plan).

Re: How Can A Free Conference Call Be Free?

#36

Post by stanleydrew »

sp332 wrote: post #13
stanleydrew wrote: post #9

This is all true. One technicality though is that Google Voice is not a VOIP solution (yet) which is why the fight with ATT over terminating rural calls is interesting.

Google Voice is not a VOIP solution Isn't it? I can make calls from my laptop microphone. What else do you need to be VOIP?

Yes I almost included that caveat. "Google Voice" is really a collection of products. Those products have the common feature that they mainly deliver voice traffic to the PSTN. That is what I meant by "not a VOIP solution." But yes, the in-browser calling product within GMail should be considered a VOIP product. It is distinct though from something like Skype which is primarily VOIP with an option to terminate to the PSTN. The Google Voice set of products is primarily a way to connect to the PSTN.

Re: How Can A Free Conference Call Be Free?

#37

Post by steveh73 »

A similar thing happened in New Zealand (and likely elsewhere) in the late 90's, before broadband became prevalent. There were a number of ISP's who provided free dial-up internet, because they made money from termination fees when the majority of people called from a large telco to their smaller one. Eventually the large telco reached a commercial agreement and the service was scrapped, but it was good while it lasted.

Re: How Can A Free Conference Call Be Free?

#38

Post by chadgeidel »

shad0wfax wrote: post #35

Interesting, I dint know that. I had an interesting experience with ATT. I was into the 6 month of a 2year contract back in 2007. I wasn't using my phone much (non-iphone). But then I went on a road trip to Yellowstone, which included driving through ND, SD, MT and WY. During this 7 day trip, I was using my phone a lot (work + personal). The total amount of minutes I spent in those 7 days were way more than my usual…

FWIW - AT&T is now in SD. (grew up there, and still have family in the state).

Re: How Can A Free Conference Call Be Free?

#39

Post by [deleted] »

VMG wrote: post #18
jballanc wrote: post #16

Bear with me here, but it seems to me like this is a good argument for socialism. Consider: why do termination fees exist? Clearly, as America was being wired with telephone service, the cost to run lines to rural areas was prohibitively expensive. So what's the capitalist/Randian thing to do? Well, charge more for phone service out there. If people can't afford it, then they'll move to where it is cheaper to have a…

So a government acts socialist, distorts the market, causes damage, and you think this is an argument for more socialism? All starting from the unwarranted assumption that telephone access was necessary to farmers and food prices would have risen dramatically.

[deleted]

Re: How Can A Free Conference Call Be Free?

#40

Post by shad0wfax »

chadgeidel wrote: post #38
shad0wfax wrote: post #35

Interesting, I dint know that. I had an interesting experience with ATT. I was into the 6 month of a 2year contract back in 2007. I wasn't using my phone much (non-iphone). But then I went on a road trip to Yellowstone, which included driving through ND, SD, MT and WY. During this 7 day trip, I was using my phone a lot (work + personal). The total amount of minutes I spent in those 7 days were way more than my usual…

FWIW - AT&T is now in SD. (grew up there, and still have family in the state).

So, I am guessing, the ATT will not be leveraging their partner networks much now.

I was in MN back then (when I took the trip). ATT was expanding then in north mid-west. Even in MN, their coverage improved between 2007-2010.

I was driving through I-90 which cuts across SD and even stayed overnight in Rapid City. I think I had good signal, which I must admit was surprising on ATT, though, I wasn't aware it was from their partner n/w backs then.

I found this incident funny, 'cos this business had the sense to know how telecoms worked, knew the law and exploited the loophole to make money :-). Sometimes, I think its just connecting the dots as Jobs said.

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