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Hertz increased its fleet of EV rental cars – then, profits exploded

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Re: Hertz increased its fleet of EV rental cars – then, profits exploded

#31

Post by almost_usual »

yazaddaruvala wrote: post #23
Majestic121 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While those numbers are extremely encouraging, the fact that this is on a new fleet is to be kept in mind. What we know now is that they 50-60% cheaper to maintain during the first couple of years. Let's hope that they are also 50-60% cheaper to maintain over their whole lifetime, but this might not be as assured as one might think due to batteries which are a huge cost.

The best part about exponential curves: By the time the battery needs to be replaced batteries will be 90% cheaper.

This seems very optimistic.

Re: Hertz increased its fleet of EV rental cars – then, profits exploded

#32

Post by gruez »

Is this really due to Hertz's electrification efforts, or just a broader trend (ie. lockdowns ending leading to more car rental use)? If we look at their competitor, we see that their profits rose even more (in percentage terms)[1]. Sure, being "50-60% cheaper to maintain" is nothing to sneeze at, but without analysis into how much that weighs against other factors (eg. depreciation, because electric cars are more expensive) making such bold claims is simply irresponsible.

[1] https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/HTZ/hertz-global-h...

https://www.macrotrends.net/stocks/charts/CAR/avis-budget/eb...

Re: Hertz increased its fleet of EV rental cars – then, profits exploded

#33

Post by elil17 »

danuker wrote: post #24
CydeWeys wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's widely known that maintenance costs way less on EVs than on gas-powered cars. There are plenty of data points everywhere to confirm this. EVs are much simpler with way fewer moving parts and fluids to worry about.

I think it remains to be seen, as batteries wear out. That could take years.

That may be true, but from the perspective of a company like Hertz they are covered by the standard 8 year warranties offered by most EV manufacturers because they do not keep cars that long anyway.

Re: Hertz increased its fleet of EV rental cars – then, profits exploded

#34

Post by pdabbadabba »

briandear wrote: post #3

> This is good news for the planet, as studies show that EVs create less carbon pollution than conventional gasoline-powered cars, even after accounting for energy expended to produce, transport, and charge them How about the mining of battery materials and the effect of that? Or the disposal of batteries. This article is pretty biased in that it fails to address the externalities of the entire EV lifecycle.

The quote you highlight says "even after accounting for energy expended to produce, transport, and charge." And the assertion holds up.

For example, this recent study University of Michigan study [1] shows BEVs producing fewer carbon emissions over their lifetime, accounting for battery production, though it takes a few years to offset the greater initial carbon footprint of BEV production. (I'm not sure that this includes battery disposal specifically. Though I wouldn't expect that to be a decisive factor on its own.)

This is a complicated topic, and I'm sure it's very challenging to accurately estimate the carbon footprint of each step in the manufacturing production and value chain (for both BEVs and ICE vehicles). So I'm sure we'll continue to get a better picture as research continues. But it's incorrect to insinuate that these issues have not been accounted for.

[1] https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1748-9326/ac7cfc

Re: Hertz increased its fleet of EV rental cars – then, profits exploded

#35

Post by eigen »

danuker wrote: post #24
CydeWeys wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's widely known that maintenance costs way less on EVs than on gas-powered cars. There are plenty of data points everywhere to confirm this. EVs are much simpler with way fewer moving parts and fluids to worry about.

I think it remains to be seen, as batteries wear out. That could take years.

do batteries wear out in the lifetime of a rental car? I would think the batteries have a lifetime of at least 10 years whereas a rental agency only keeps the car for <4 years.

Re: Hertz increased its fleet of EV rental cars – then, profits exploded

#36

Post by astura »

danuker wrote: post #24
CydeWeys wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's widely known that maintenance costs way less on EVs than on gas-powered cars. There are plenty of data points everywhere to confirm this. EVs are much simpler with way fewer moving parts and fluids to worry about.

I think it remains to be seen, as batteries wear out. That could take years.

Idk how true this is, but I keep hearing that car batteries have gotten so good they are likely to outlive the car.

Anyways, these are rentals, which are usually sold after around 1 year/30,000-40,000 miles. So it's irrelevant for a rental car company if batteries last longer than that.

Re: Hertz increased its fleet of EV rental cars – then, profits exploded

#37

Post by [deleted] »

danuker wrote: post #24
CydeWeys wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's widely known that maintenance costs way less on EVs than on gas-powered cars. There are plenty of data points everywhere to confirm this. EVs are much simpler with way fewer moving parts and fluids to worry about.

I think it remains to be seen, as batteries wear out. That could take years.

[deleted]

Re: Hertz increased its fleet of EV rental cars – then, profits exploded

#38

Post by [deleted] »

CydeWeys wrote: post #16
almost_usual wrote: post #9

Not many details on what components failed or how maintenance is better. I don’t doubt the claims but this feels like greenwashing PR.

It's widely known that maintenance costs way less on EVs than on gas-powered cars. There are plenty of data points everywhere to confirm this. EVs are much simpler with way fewer moving parts and fluids to worry about.

[deleted]

Re: Hertz increased its fleet of EV rental cars – then, profits exploded

#40

Post by CydeWeys »

metadat wrote: post #4
cs702 wrote: post #2

According to the OP, Hertz has found that EVs are "between 50-60% cheaper to maintain than gasoline-powered cars." That's a huge difference. It means that the cost of using an ICE vehicle over time is 2x greater. If the figure is anywhere near accurate, ICE vehicles are toast.

Strange claim, because Hertz's fleets are comprised of new and almost brand new vehicles, which usually only require oil changes. Then they sell them off after accumulating 10,000-25,000 miles, before any real maintenance is required. 20,000 miles is what, 4-6 oil changes?

I would be curious to see absolute values on this rather than percentages. Not having to do oil changes could easily be a 50% decrease, but oil changes also really aren't that expensive overall on a few tens of thousands of miles, right?
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