Microsoft sues UK retailer Comet for selling over 94k counterfeit Windows CDs • Hacker News Board

Re: Microsoft sues UK retailer Comet for selling over 94k counterfeit Windows CDs

#31

Post by powertower » Wed, Jan 04, 2012, 3:24 PM UTC

VonLipwig wrote: post #23

The story is misleading. It say's that Comet sold 94k counterfeit Windows CD's. Comet seem to say that as manufacturers stopped packaging computer's with CD's they decided to make their own. Assuming this is true. Each computer had a valid Windows license. Comet decided to burn the CD's itself so users didn't have to try to make their own recovery disks. I don't seem the harm. I mean.. users can make their own recove…

We'd have to look at the details of the lawsuit itself to get the real story. There could be much more to this.

Re: Microsoft sues UK retailer Comet for selling over 94k counterfeit Windows CDs

#32

Post by blasterford » Wed, Jan 04, 2012, 3:37 PM UTC

Deestan wrote: post #22

blasterford wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry to say it, but if you buy an extended warranty on anything you're wasting your money. The whole 'extended warranty' business is how retailers make their money, but are a complete scam. Hardly anything goes wrong these days, and the price of the extended warranty is far far higher than the risk of it going wrong.

It can work, though. Some retailers do it properly. I have had use for it for a printer and a portable CD player. The extra warranty was about +10% of the product price, and they said it covered "anything, including kids dropping it on the floor or you spilling coffee on it". Unsurprisingly, the CD player lid stopped working because the kids managed to knock it off a shelf. I took it back to the outlet and got a new…

> and they said it covered "anything, including kids dropping it on the floor or you spilling coffee on it".

That should raise a giant red flag. Unless you're extremely careless and don't look after things, you're paying for other peoples carelessness.

Re: Microsoft sues UK retailer Comet for selling over 94k counterfeit Windows CDs

#33

Post by galadriel » Wed, Jan 04, 2012, 3:42 PM UTC

VonLipwig wrote: post #23

The story is misleading. It say's that Comet sold 94k counterfeit Windows CD's. Comet seem to say that as manufacturers stopped packaging computer's with CD's they decided to make their own. Assuming this is true. Each computer had a valid Windows license. Comet decided to burn the CD's itself so users didn't have to try to make their own recovery disks. I don't seem the harm. I mean.. users can make their own recove…

Just guessing without the details of the case, Comet most likely had a license to sell Windows pre-installed on their computer, but not for supplying a recovery disc. Microsoft is well within its right to sell Windows which ever way they like, as long as they don't abuse their monopoly.

If Comet felt that their customer were not getting a good deal and that Microsoft was monopolistic, there are other recourse in law, which do not involve violating copyrights.

Re: Microsoft sues UK retailer Comet for selling over 94k counterfeit Windows CDs

#34

Post by domador » Wed, Jan 04, 2012, 3:51 PM UTC

guelo wrote: post #12

I haven't bought a retail Windows PC in a while, is there not normally a Windows CD included?

Not bundling a recovery disc with a laptop is a major disservice to customers. Especially when the program to produce the recovery discs requires two blank DVDs, runs into errors on the second disc, and makes you start the whole process from the beginning (instead of letting you only burn the second disc). That was my experience with a laptop I acquired a few months ago. I needlessly burned two or three copies of the first disc while trying to get the second disc to burn correctly.

Re: Microsoft sues UK retailer Comet for selling over 94k counterfeit Windows CDs

#35

Post by Deestan » Wed, Jan 04, 2012, 4:08 PM UTC

blasterford wrote: post #32

Deestan wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can work, though. Some retailers do it properly. I have had use for it for a printer and a portable CD player. The extra warranty was about +10% of the product price, and they said it covered "anything, including kids dropping it on the floor or you spilling coffee on it". Unsurprisingly, the CD player lid stopped working because the kids managed to knock it off a shelf. I took it back to the outlet and got a new…

> and they said it covered "anything, including kids dropping it on the floor or you spilling coffee on it". That should raise a giant red flag. Unless you're extremely careless and don't look after things, you're paying for other peoples carelessness.

Or I could think of it as gambling that enough other people either 1) are lucky, 2) don't bother with the return ("I don't really need it/want another.") or 3) forget about the return.

But, I don't think of it in terms of how much money I "save" by breaking stuff.

I pay the extra cost and try to be careful. What I get back is Less Worry. If the thingy breaks down, I get a new thingy. That's worth money to me.

The alternative is to handle the risk myself, and saving the 10%s into a "surprise expense account" to use when things break down. I'm convinced I don't have the discipline for that - both managing it and not using the money for other expenses.

Re: Microsoft sues UK retailer Comet for selling over 94k counterfeit Windows CDs

#36

Post by Tyrannosaurs » Wed, Jan 04, 2012, 4:09 PM UTC

dan1234 wrote: post #15

m4tt wrote: post #7

Comet has issued a response to the lawsuit: “Comet has sought and received legal advice from leading counsel to support its view that the production of recovery discs did not infringe Microsoft’s intellectual property. “Comet firmly believes that it acted in the very best interests of its customers. It believes its customers had been adversely affected by the decision to stop supplying recovery discs with each new Mi…

Did Comet seek Microsoft's permission to start mass producing recovery discs? Did they make any profit by selling them? I'd imagine a certain amount of money will change hands and hasty apology made before the issue quickly disappears, especially considering Comet is currently being sold to another company.

You'd have thought that MS and Comet would have discussed this before MS launched legal action. The fact it's come to this would suggest that at least initial attempts to reach a settlement have failed.

I actually support Comet in this case - I think they're doing the right thing by their users - but I suspect legally MS have got them banged to rights.

Re: Microsoft sues UK retailer Comet for selling over 94k counterfeit Windows CDs

#37

Post by Tyrannosaurs » Wed, Jan 04, 2012, 4:10 PM UTC

xd wrote: post #29

VonLipwig wrote: post #23

The story is misleading. It say's that Comet sold 94k counterfeit Windows CD's. Comet seem to say that as manufacturers stopped packaging computer's with CD's they decided to make their own. Assuming this is true. Each computer had a valid Windows license. Comet decided to burn the CD's itself so users didn't have to try to make their own recovery disks. I don't seem the harm. I mean.. users can make their own recove…

I think the problem is, comet where selling the cds. I'd be curious to know for how much.

That's not what Comet are saying. They're providing them as recovery CDs to people purchasing machines with Windows installed.

That said there is a question whether they were providing them free or at a cost.

Re: Microsoft sues UK retailer Comet for selling over 94k counterfeit Windows CDs

#38

Post by blasterford » Wed, Jan 04, 2012, 4:39 PM UTC

Deestan wrote: post #35

blasterford wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> and they said it covered "anything, including kids dropping it on the floor or you spilling coffee on it". That should raise a giant red flag. Unless you're extremely careless and don't look after things, you're paying for other peoples carelessness.

Or I could think of it as gambling that enough other people either 1) are lucky, 2) don't bother with the return ("I don't really need it/want another.") or 3) forget about the return. But, I don't think of it in terms of how much money I "save" by breaking stuff. I pay the extra cost and try to be careful. What I get back is Less Worry. If the thingy breaks down, I get a new thingy. That's worth money to me. The alt…

A recent survey found that something ridiculous like 0.5% of TVs break down within 5 years. Yet people are paying out a lot of money for extended warranties on them.

It's a matter of cost vs hassle as you say though I guess. For me, if I have 10 electronic gadgets and one blows up, it's not really a big deal, because I can buy a new one with the money I saved by not having extended warranties on all 10 items.

Re: Microsoft sues UK retailer Comet for selling over 94k counterfeit Windows CDs

#39

Post by dan1234 » Wed, Jan 04, 2012, 4:59 PM UTC

alexchamberlain wrote: post #27

dan1234 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem seems to be that they haven't been giving their customers these discs, but selling them.

How much for? It would be reasonable for them to charge a small fee for the disc and burning, as long as they made it clear the customer didn't have to buy it from them and that they could make this same CD at home. I think Microsoft need to defend their IP, but not at the expense of a business trying to provide a genuine customer service. A conversation, rather than a court filing, may have been more appropriate in…

I think Microsoft need to get convince the manufacturers that not providing any physical recovery medium is not acceptable.

IMHO, a recovery disc or USB drive should be supplied as standard, as part of the Windows licence.

Re: Microsoft sues UK retailer Comet for selling over 94k counterfeit Windows CDs

#40

Post by kenjackson » Wed, Jan 04, 2012, 6:09 PM UTC

blasterford wrote: post #9

hellweaver666 wrote: post #5

Comet are a shady bunch... they're well known over here for selling extended warranties that they refuse to honor. I've been stung by it myself but stupidly didn't do the research until it was too late.

Sorry to say it, but if you buy an extended warranty on anything you're wasting your money. The whole 'extended warranty' business is how retailers make their money, but are a complete scam. Hardly anything goes wrong these days, and the price of the extended warranty is far far higher than the risk of it going wrong.

Sears appliances and extended warranties actually seem like a good deal. I've certainly come out ahead fairly consistently on them, and the service is excellent.

I actually think it is one of the rare cases where the extended warranty may be a loss leader. I only by major appliances from Sears due to their service, and tell my family to do the same.

In fact, I once thought I hadn't renewed a warranty on my fridge, when it went bad. After the repair guy was done fixing it and gave me my quote, I handed him my credit card to pay for it. After 30s he hands it back and says, "You have almost a year left on warranty." I had gotten the years mixed up.