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Some Remarks on Large Language Models

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Re: Some Remarks on Large Language Models

#31
post #2

Sometimes I read text like this and really enjoy the deep insights and arguments once I filter out the emotion, attitude, or tone. And I wonder if the core of what they're trying to communicate would be better or more efficiently received if the text was more neutral or positive. E.g. you can be 'bearish' on something and point out 'limitations', or you can say 'this is where I think we are' and 'this is how I think…

Maybe you can ask chatGPT for a summary in a less emotional tone ;)

Re: Some Remarks on Large Language Models

#32
post #2

Sometimes I read text like this and really enjoy the deep insights and arguments once I filter out the emotion, attitude, or tone. And I wonder if the core of what they're trying to communicate would be better or more efficiently received if the text was more neutral or positive. E.g. you can be 'bearish' on something and point out 'limitations', or you can say 'this is where I think we are' and 'this is how I think…

But then it would feel less personal and be more boring. Writing should convey emotion - it’s what we have as humans to offer in linking with others, and great writing should in turn make you feel something.

Disagree: great (non-fiction) writing should provide information in an efficient and structured way, so that readers can quickly understand the key points and if reading further is worth their time.

Re: Some Remarks on Large Language Models

#33
post #2

Sometimes I read text like this and really enjoy the deep insights and arguments once I filter out the emotion, attitude, or tone. And I wonder if the core of what they're trying to communicate would be better or more efficiently received if the text was more neutral or positive. E.g. you can be 'bearish' on something and point out 'limitations', or you can say 'this is where I think we are' and 'this is how I think…

What emotional tone did you arrive to? If "bearish" is your take away I think you should read it more carefully.

Re: Some Remarks on Large Language Models

#34
post #30

I would like to see the section on "Common-yet-boring" arguments cleaned up a bit. There is a whole category of "researchers" who just spend their time criticizing LLMs with common-yet-boring arguments (Emily Bender is the best example) such as "they cost a lot to train" (uhhh have you seen how much enterprise spends on cloud for non-LLM stuff? Or seen the power consumption of an aluminum smelting plant? Or calcuated…

> Or calculated the costs of all the airplanes flying around

This is the key comparison. A 747-400 burns 10+ metric tons of kerosene per hour, which means its basic energy consumption is > 110MW. The cost to train GPT-3 was approximately the same energy spent by one 8-hour airline flight.

Re: Some Remarks on Large Language Models

#35

> In particular, if the model is trained on multiple news stories about the same event, it has no way of knowing that these texts all describe the same thing, and it cannot differentiate it from several texts describing similar but unrelated events And... the claim is that humans can do this? Is it just the boring "This AI can only receive information via tokens, whereas humans get it via more high resolution senses…

I'd say this is more related to the observation that LLMs aren't going to be good at math. (As the article says, their current performance is surprising enough as it is but I agree that it seems unlikely that just making bigger and bigger LLMs is going to get substantially better at even arithmetic, to say nothing of higher math.) They have a decent understanding of "X before Y" as a textual phrase, but I think it would be hard for them do very much further logic based on that temporal logic because it lacks the representation for it, as it lacks the representation suitable for math.

I expect if you asked "Did $FAMOUS_EVENT happen before $OTHER_FAMOUS_EVENT" it would do OK, just as "What is $FAMOUS_NUMBER plus $FAMOUS_NUMBER?" does OK, but as you get more obscure it will fall down badly on tasks that humans would generally do OK at.

Though, no, humans are not perfect at this by any means either.

It is important to remember that what this entire technology boils down to is "what word is most likely to follow the content up to this point?", iterated. What that can do is impressive, no question, but at the same time, if you can try to imagine interacting with the world through that one and only tool, you may be able to better understand the limitations of this technology too. There are some tasks that just can't be performed that way.

(You'll have a hard time doing so, though. It is very hard to think in that manner. As a human I really tend to think in a bare minimum of sentences at a time, which I then serialize into words. Trying to imagine operating in terms of "OK, what's the next word?" "OK, what's the next word?" "OK, what's the next word?" with no forward planning beyond what is implied by your choice of this particular word is not something that comes even remotely naturally to us.)

When this tech answers the question "Did $FAMOUS_EVENT happen before $OTHER_FAMOUS_EVENT?", it is not thinking, OK, this event happened in 1876 and the other event happened in 1986, so, yes, it's before. It is thinking "What is the most likely next word after '... $OTHER_FAMOUS_EVENT?" "What is the next most likely word after that?" and so on. For famous events it is reasonably likely to get them right because the training data has relationships for the famous events. It might even make mistakes in a very human manner. But it's not doing temporal logic, because it can't. There's nowhere for "temporal logic" to be taking place.

Re: Some Remarks on Large Language Models

#36
post #30

I would like to see the section on "Common-yet-boring" arguments cleaned up a bit. There is a whole category of "researchers" who just spend their time criticizing LLMs with common-yet-boring arguments (Emily Bender is the best example) such as "they cost a lot to train" (uhhh have you seen how much enterprise spends on cloud for non-LLM stuff? Or seen the power consumption of an aluminum smelting plant? Or calcuated…

[deleted]

Re: Some Remarks on Large Language Models

#37
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

" The models encode many biases and stereotypes. Well, sure they do. They model observed human's language, and we humans are terrible beings, we are biased and are constantly stereotyping. This means we need to be careful when applying these models to real-world tasks, but it doesn't make them less valid, useful or interesting from a scientiic perspective." Not sure how this can be seen as dismissive. >Yoav can dismi…

Or maybe he is blind to or unaffected by such biases either due to luck or wealth or other outliers. Especially as a Jewish person in Israel. There are always plenty of people in minority groups that feel (either correctly or incorrectly) that bias doesn't affect them. Take Clarence Thomas for example, or Candace Owens. Simply being a member of a minority group does not make your opinion correct. Thomas even said in…

>Simply being a member of a minority group does not make your opinion correct.

Nor does being a member of the majority make yours incorrect.

Re: Some Remarks on Large Language Models

#38
post #34
post #30

I would like to see the section on "Common-yet-boring" arguments cleaned up a bit. There is a whole category of "researchers" who just spend their time criticizing LLMs with common-yet-boring arguments (Emily Bender is the best example) such as "they cost a lot to train" (uhhh have you seen how much enterprise spends on cloud for non-LLM stuff? Or seen the power consumption of an aluminum smelting plant? Or calcuated…

> Or calculated the costs of all the airplanes flying around This is the key comparison. A 747-400 burns 10+ metric tons of kerosene per hour, which means its basic energy consumption is > 110MW. The cost to train GPT-3 was approximately the same energy spent by one 8-hour airline flight.

Equivalently, the energy used to train GPT-3 was the same as the energy consumed by Bitcoin in just four minutes.

Re: Some Remarks on Large Language Models

#40
post #2

Sometimes I read text like this and really enjoy the deep insights and arguments once I filter out the emotion, attitude, or tone. And I wonder if the core of what they're trying to communicate would be better or more efficiently received if the text was more neutral or positive. E.g. you can be 'bearish' on something and point out 'limitations', or you can say 'this is where I think we are' and 'this is how I think…

What emotional tone did you arrive to? If "bearish" is your take away I think you should read it more carefully.

I'd rewrite sections like this to be a bit less "insulting the intelligence of the question-asker".

The models do not understand language like humans do.

Duh? they are not humans? Of course they differ in some of their mechanisms. They still can tell us a lot about language structure. And for what they don't tell us, we can look elsewhere.

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