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Would Obama Veto SOPA? Extremely Doubtful

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Re: Would Obama Veto SOPA? Extremely Doubtful

#31
post #3

Throughout his administration, the President has left almost all intellectual property issues up to Vice President Joe Biden Classic. Leave IP issues to the plagiarist.

I'm sorry, are you trying to say that this administration is doing too little to protect intellectual property? If you're saying the IP issues are being left to someone who doesn't respect IP, that is the only conclusion I can draw.

Re: Would Obama Veto SOPA? Extremely Doubtful

#32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep second that. Last election he ran on transparency, change and hope. And as three years went by there was no transparency in billions of dollars (TARP) given to big corporations. Change? yeah sure, for worse. And he does not talk about hope any more, since millions of Americans does no have job and economy is not even getting better. In this campaign he is all about class warfare, soak the rich taxes. Do we even c…

Come on now, don't misuse facts. TARP was executed in 2008 and most of it was paid off by the end of 2009. Obama became president in jan 2009.

People don't care, he gets blamed for stuff that happened before he was in office all the time. I've seen Republican members of congress publicly blame him for TARP too. The downturn we're in right now is the "Obama economy" even though it started before he was elected.

Re: Would Obama Veto SOPA? Extremely Doubtful

#33
post #30
post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tor just isn't that important. It was a comparatively minor project from a minor agency where it is no longer developed. Not only that, but Tor is too closely associated with the seedier sides of the internet for any elected politician to stand up for it specifically. Thinking that the President will override a bill because of a minor thing like Tor is grasping at straws.

Well, he wouldn't ever publicly say he's vetoing it to protect Tor -- that would be political suicide, due to all of the CP thereon -- but he might still veto it for that reason, and claim another, cf. Iraq War.

I'm getting a bit frustrated here.

Obama's not going to veto SOPA based on a (borderline) argument that it makes a tool which might be used by intelligence agencies, in some possible circumstances possibly illegal.

The argument that it needs lots of non-agency uses to hide traffic is plainly nonsense. If an intelligence agent (or subversive citizen) is using it in a country where it is banned they are going to be in trouble no matter if it is illegal in the US or not.

If it was a concern for US intelligence agencies (which I don't concede it is at all) then that can easily handle it themselves - they get an executive order allowing them to run exit nodes and then what they are doing is legal. Even by the borderline argument that Tor could be illegal under SOPA would only make it a problem for people running exit nodes - use by the general population. I doubt any intelligence agency would complain about being ordered to run a Tor exit node - I think they would love it.

I find it bizarre that people are even talking about this, when in the same source article where this was first raised it said the following:

"Browsers implementing DNSSEC will have to circumvent and bypass criminal blocking, and in the process, they will also circumvent and bypass SOPA orders." A successful injunction from the attorney general, Baker said, would shut down all shipments of a Web browser "until it's been revised to the satisfaction of his staff and their advisers in Hollywood."[1]

The US federal government provided funding to develop and deploy DNSSEC[2], too, and that is also useful for dissidents overseas. It also helps secure communications for billions (if not trillions) of dollars in ecommerce transaction. If that is ignored, do you really think Tor is going to get the bill vetoed?

[1] http://news.cnet.com/8301-31921_3-57346592-281/how-sopas-cir...

[2] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Domain_Name_System_Security_Ext...

Re: Would Obama Veto SOPA? Extremely Doubtful

#34

Basis for an effective counterargument: A gut feeling tells me that if somebody did an analysis of Obama's last campaign then they would find that he would have violated the current form of SOPA multiple times. A potential new argument against SOPA would be that it limits the campaigning power of political candidates, especially those running for higher offices. Not a particularly strong argument, but I don't think a…

A gut feeling tells me that if somebody did an analysis of Obama's last campaign then they would find that he would have violated the current form of SOPA multiple times.

On what basis? The was the controversy over the ownership of the Obama Hope image, but apart from that I' not aware of anything that would have violated SOPA.

Enlighten me, please.

Re: Would Obama Veto SOPA? Extremely Doubtful

#35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obama's not running his last campaign. That's done and over with. It's as simple as that.

Who will vote for him then? I am honestly curious. My impression was that young voters (users of the internet) were the key to Obama's success last time. Are the other republican candidates so weak that Obama can just scoop up a bunch of their voters?

Two scenarios seem likely:

1) The Republican party will nominate Mitt Romney, and the election will be a closely contested competition between two men who are disliked by the most active parts of their respective parties.

2) The Republicans will nominate one of the crazy brigade, who will have a small set of very loud proponents but will scare moderate Republicans enough not to vote, and scare Democrats and independents enough that they will turn up to vote for Obama.

(There are other, less likely options. Huntsman is centralist enough to gets votes from unsatisfied independents, and I think Perry could win if he managed to get the nomination. http://fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/12/27/how-can-... is a good summary of the current state of the Republican race)

Re: Would Obama Veto SOPA? Extremely Doubtful

#36
What a lot of people don't seem to realize is that the issues that are so very important to them are probably just not that important to the president (if he even knows about them at all.) He has a whole world full of things to worry about and only 365 days a year. When something so important to you such as SOPA arrives on his desk, he probably is forced to paint with very broad strokes. Should I be strong on IP, weak on IP? Does my party support it? The specific long term effects that so many of us fear probably don't even cross his mind.

Re: Would Obama Veto SOPA? Extremely Doubtful

#37
post #6

There are some interesting points here, but the article misses one very, very important constituency (from the President's point of view, at least): the intelligence community. If the law remains as is and outlaws Tor, Obama will have the head of every intelligence agency in his office telling him to veto the bill or put the nation at risk. If the law is amended to allow Tor (as was attempted) and then passes, then h…

I wish you were right but I really don't think Tor would stop the bill. I personally expect that SOPA will eventually pass and then portions of it will get struck down as unconstitutional.

> and then portions of it will get struck down as unconstitutional.

This is still a problem. How long has it been since the PATRIOT Act was signed into law (Oct 26, 2001) and how many of it's 325 amendments and 9 additions have been repealed due to judicial decisions noting that they are against the rights granted to US citizens under the constitution or bill of rights?

Re: Would Obama Veto SOPA? Extremely Doubtful

#38
post #23
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The frustrating part is that the internet and tech companies opposed to SOPA have plenty of gold . They're just not using it.

I agree. They are frustratingly quiet. Any ideas why?

Increased regulatory compliance costs plays to the advantage of existing big players. The government won't really let Google or Facebook be destroyed. DuckDuckGo or Diaspora? No tears shed. Losing some profit today to know that you just raised the bar of entry for your industry impossibly high for everybody else? A hard offer to resist.

Re: Would Obama Veto SOPA? Extremely Doubtful

#39
post #23
post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The frustrating part is that the internet and tech companies opposed to SOPA have plenty of gold . They're just not using it.

I agree. They are frustratingly quiet. Any ideas why?

because SOPA doesn't hurt them. It hurts SMALL businesses.

Re: Would Obama Veto SOPA? Extremely Doubtful

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obama's not running his last campaign. That's done and over with. It's as simple as that.

Yep second that. Last election he ran on transparency, change and hope. And as three years went by there was no transparency in billions of dollars (TARP) given to big corporations. Change? yeah sure, for worse. And he does not talk about hope any more, since millions of Americans does no have job and economy is not even getting better. In this campaign he is all about class warfare, soak the rich taxes. Do we even c…

>Make me fool once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me.

That's not how you say it. Not in Tennessee, not in Texas.

Fool me once, shame on you, fool me can't get fooled again.

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