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Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

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Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#31

Post by smashed »

overshard wrote: post #5

I used to use Ubuntu for everything and was very happy in the massive Ubuntu ecosystem with a .deb for everything till I was forced to use Snap a few releases ago for installing even some basic utils I used on a daily basis. I then had Snap constantly hang on installs and just break for no apparent reason and waste my time debugging it. It didn't "just work" anymore. Swapped to Arch and haven't looked back yet, Arch…

My first encounter with snaps was launching gcalc, the basic built-in calculator app.

At some point after an update, launching that app would take multiple seconds. How could the most basic gtk app be so slow to launch.

Investigating further, I found the update had transformed the normal gcalc package into a snap, probably just to prove how great snaps could be for desktop apps?

What a bad way to introduce your latest tech canonical. From then on, my opinion of snaps was very negative and I still do everything possible to avoid them. Even if they are technically great or more secure, canonical messed up their introduction and are now stuck pushing a dead horse.

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#33

Post by aliqot »

RedShift1 wrote: post #11
encryptluks2 wrote: post #2

Everyday is like a new Ubuntu release on Arch Linux and in 8 years I've only had to boot into a rescue environment one time and it was due to me using a non-standard configuration.

Everybody has a story like that about every distro ever

[flagged]

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#34

Post by aliqot »

nix23 wrote: post #32
aliqot wrote: post #28

Ubuntu seems to be doing a speedrun of Microsoft's Embrace, Extend, Extinguish.

Yeah but themself and not other's...maybe they don't understand the meaning of it?

I don't understand your comment, but would like to make the observation that Canonical vis-a-vis Ubuntu is trying to make Ubuntu as ubiquitous as Windows when it comes to someones 'first' Linux system, or as a Linux system that "Just works" and are abusing this position (in my opinion) to push forward proprietary and regressive technologies like Snap. Open source does not negate something being proprietary. There are many 'one format' packages out there, flatpak and appimage being two great ones. Snap is two steps back, no steps forward, but it has that Ubuntu logo which conveys authority, and that's about as un-Linux like as it gets.

By virtue of power-of-authority, they're quite literally forcing this garbage on the greater linux ecosystem that other people simply don't even know exists. Ask anybody on the street if they know what a Linux is and if the answer isn't 'no', the ones who can respond will say something like 'oh yeah, i have ubuntu on my thumb drive'.

If you'd have told me this would happen in 1995, I'd have said you're nuts and gone back to hammering dents out of my Yggdrasil install as I chuckled.

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#35

Post by jonesnc »

overshard wrote: post #5

I used to use Ubuntu for everything and was very happy in the massive Ubuntu ecosystem with a .deb for everything till I was forced to use Snap a few releases ago for installing even some basic utils I used on a daily basis. I then had Snap constantly hang on installs and just break for no apparent reason and waste my time debugging it. It didn't "just work" anymore. Swapped to Arch and haven't looked back yet, Arch…

I'm on Ubuntu Server 22.04, and I've never had to use Snap. Is it exclusively a Desktop thing?

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#36

Post by smallerfish »

CoastalCoder wrote: post #26
severino wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also use Ubuntu a lot, and while I'm disappointed about this Snap thing, I'm still not looking for alternatives. At least until 22.04 I could dodge snaps pretty easily, but now, since Firefox is now a snap package, things went worse, at least for me. I gave it a try and, while the experience was not as bad as I feared, I soon encountered problems with things like trying to use a smartcard reader for signing documen…

> Maybe I should give Pop OS a try... I'm a big fan: it's like Ubuntu, but with much of Canonical's divisive changes reverted, and with a few other improvements. I switched from Ubuntu to Pop!_OS a few releases back when I got a System76 computer. (I also use it on my Lenovo laptop.)

I wish Pop OS would tackle KDE. It's a much better DE (particularly if you like to customize), but there are very few (if any) distributions which have an opinionated tuned experience out of the box.

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#37

Post by rgoulter »

nagyf wrote: post #13
bxparks wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linux Mint is based on Ubuntu but does not use snap. Doing "a lot more work" to install an OS does not sound appealing.

Yeah, setting up arch for the first time takes time. For newbie users it is definitely not appealing process, and also I would not recommend it. It's not a long process, but you do everything yourself and all this in the terminal (no GUI installer). I learned a lot about linux when I decided to try Arch. And as OP, I also never looked back :)

My experience with Arch (which I tried after I'd used Linux Mint) was that for the first few weeks I was constantly consulting the Arch Linux Wiki to get anything done. -- I mean, yes, the emphasis is on "learned a lot".

The Arch Linux Wiki is a fantastic resource.

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#38

Post by Nullabillity »

bxparks wrote: post #10
overshard wrote: post #5

I used to use Ubuntu for everything and was very happy in the massive Ubuntu ecosystem with a .deb for everything till I was forced to use Snap a few releases ago for installing even some basic utils I used on a daily basis. I then had Snap constantly hang on installs and just break for no apparent reason and waste my time debugging it. It didn't "just work" anymore. Swapped to Arch and haven't looked back yet, Arch…

Linux Mint is based on Ubuntu but does not use snap. Doing "a lot more work" to install an OS does not sound appealing.

As Ubuntu gradually snapifies more and more stuff, Mint is either going to start falling behind or have to redo Ubuntu's packages (reducing any benefits of the Ubuntu heritage...).

Mint might be an OK stopgap, but I wouldn't call it a long-term solution to Ubuntu's snap infestation. Just like you won't get a good OS by playing whack-a-mole with the various workarounds you have to do to avoid Windows' latest user-hostile bullshit.

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#39

Post by gibspaulding »

silisili wrote: post #29
rubyist5eva wrote: post #7

of course the only comments so far are people complaining that Ubuntu sucks and their $PREFERRED_DISTRO is better I for one think Steam as a snap is a great idea, and was pleasantly surprised with them taking the feedback about the Firefox snap to heart and actually putting in the work to speed it up. I was gonna install 22.04.1 tonight (finally got fedup with Windows) but I'm gonna try this tonight instead and defin…

I don't think it's 'my distro is better' as much as it is people who loved ubuntu pissed off in the direction they went with Snaps. At least, that's my personal position. IMO, snaps have no reason to exist other than NIH. But, if they wanted to do it anyways, fine. But it should have always been opt in, and people could for example try out the Steam snap. Instead they made everything a snap mess that rarely works qui…

I liked the idea of snaps as something like the AUR. Basically a straightforward way to get un-trusted/closed source software installed without giving some random installer root on my system. Apps like Steam, Spotify, Discord, maybe even Chrome make a lot of sense since they don't really fit into a traditional open source distribution model, but I wish they'd stick with apt for anything open source.

Re: Ubuntu 22.10 Kinetic Kudu

#40

Post by ss108 »

"It also includes the latest toolchains and applications with a particular focus on the IoT ecosystem."

Dude, the OS can't even handle two monitors half the time...

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