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Charging cars at home at night is not the way to go: study

news.stanford.edu

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Re: Charging cars at home at night is not the way to go: study

#31

Post by alexb_ »

3pt14159 wrote: post #4

This is simple. Musk just needs to throw 1% of his AI talent at optimizing charging times via realtime grid negotiating and nobody will need to even think about this. Cars will turn into one of our most valuable assets as they help stabalize the grid by being both sinks when energy is plentiful and sources when it's not. There are certain problems we all need to think about, but this is not one of them. It will effec…

If there's excess demand at night, you increase the price at night. If there's excess supply in the morning/afternoon, you lower the price. It's not complicated, and the problem fixes itself. You don't need AI to simulate what groups of people making rational, independent decisions do themselves. That's how you get cars that won't charge because "AI says so", similar to how all of these dogshit smart thermostats can be completely shut off from heating if "AI says so".

Re: Charging cars at home at night is not the way to go: study

#32

Post by calrain »

My understanding was that it helps countries with nuclear powered base electrical load to use that power at night, when there isn't a lot of demand.

With further development, a key side benefit is that the grid can then tap into about 5% of your cars battery storage during the day when demand is higher (if you allow it).

Re: Charging cars at home at night is not the way to go: study

#33

Post by kadoban »

ctrlmeta wrote: post #24
kadoban wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Charge at work.

But how many work areas have a charging station available easily?

Not as many as should. The state can probably incentivize creating some more, and job seekers can prioritize it as well. Not to mention workers just asking their employers to do it.

Re: Charging cars at home at night is not the way to go: study

#34

Post by DropPanda »

This is very interesting and perfectly logical. I wrote a fairly recent report looking at a very similar question, and reached the opposite conclusion: night time charging is far better for the grid. That study however focuses on Sweden, where solar power only marginally impacts day-time supply.

Link to the study: http://urn.kb.se/resolve?urn=urn%3Anbn%3Ase%3Ari%3Adiva-5752...

If the western US has a surplus in mornings and afternoons, you guys really should invest in dynamic charging using electrified roads (commonly referred to as wireless inductive charging in California, but there are conductive solutions as well).

Re: Charging cars at home at night is not the way to go: study

#36

Post by cortesoft »

dominotw wrote: post #19

I personally think Govt should ban home charging if they are going to ban non-EV vehicles. How is that rich people with homes charge at home while everyone else has to queue up and waste their time at charging stations. Doesn't seem fair at all. Its a extra time tax on the poor.

So your solution to some people having an easier time charging is to make it worse for everyone?

Re: Charging cars at home at night is not the way to go: study

#37

Post by adrianN »

ctrlmeta wrote: post #28
wing-_-nuts wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Frankly, if a user cannot trust their EV to charge without going up in flames it is not ready for prime time and should be recalled. Period.

Yes! It surprises me that the reliability issues in charging an EV are not discussed more. This bears more discussion and subject to regulations. It is not ok for companies to push EVs to general consumers without creating a good safety record.

How many EVs spontaneously combust while charging?

Re: Charging cars at home at night is not the way to go: study

#39

Post by Grimburger »

alexb_ wrote: post #17

>We're doing it wrong, according to a new Stanford study Wrong according to what metric? Cost? Raw efficiency? A lot of people are more than willing to give up efficiency so that they don't have to actually worry about finding a station during the day. To say that something is just outright "wrong" based on their personal preference of priorities comes off as unhelpful to me. The solution is simple. Make electricity…

> The solution is simple. Make electricity cheaper when it's more available

From the parts of the world I come from the majority of people are vehemently opposed to time of use pricing. Because that's when they use it most.

They and their political representatives would much prefer to keep taking from those who consume in off-peak rather than fix the underlying mechanism.

Re: Charging cars at home at night is not the way to go: study

#40

Post by floatrock »

lelag wrote: post #9

It's not just about the rate. Charging at night happens because the car is conveniently parked at home doing nothing and EV owners want a car ready to go in the morning. Charging at EV station during the day is time consuming and is often expensive. I'm sure that the lucky few that can charge at work already do so...

It's almost as if the logical conclusion is to invest in convenient workplace charging infrastructure so charging is simple when the car is conveniently parked at work doing nothing and the owner wants a car ready to go home in the evening...

> “We encourage policymakers to consider utility rates that encourage day charging and incentivize investment in charging infrastructure to shift drivers from home to work for charging,” said the study’s co-senior author, Ram Rajagopal

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