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Cops wanted to keep mass surveillance app secret; privacy advocates refused

arstechnica.com

31–40 of 150 posts

Re: Cops wanted to keep mass surveillance app secret; privacy advocates refused

#31

I find it less concerning that the police have this info, than the fact that it's just a random company providing it and presumably anybody with the cash to buy access could buy the same or equivalent system.

Yep, not long before any disgruntled ex, or any other bad actor could look up anyone and find out their everything. In fact, such an app might be what's needed to blow the lid off the whole thing.

Re: Cops wanted to keep mass surveillance app secret; privacy advocates refused

#32
Data aggregation and retainment of such data is the problem. There isn’t a reasonable need for anybody to log such data and such data should also be copyrighted to the entity creating it. Laws should require express written authorization for use from each individual. The generation and retaining should be hard to prevent the data being used for unnecessary uses.

Re: Cops wanted to keep mass surveillance app secret; privacy advocates refused

#33
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is why "defund the police" became a slogan: operational control against abuse just doesn't work, so the blunt instrument of reducing the amount of money for toys is the only one left.

But it's exactly the same mistake as the supposed "starve the beast" policy. If someone really doesn't trust the government to spend money on the right programs, then they shouldn't expect that reducing tax revenue will make the government prioritize the same things they would. Besides, governments can produce very bad outcomes with almost no budget at all, since some of the worst things in life are free. If cops lik…

This speaks to my ongoing crusade to try inject pragmatism into the political conversation. There are far too many unintended consequences to this sloganeering that is used to stir up the populace.

We need to get away from focusing on intent of a change and look at the practical effects of the change.

Re: Cops wanted to keep mass surveillance app secret; privacy advocates refused

#36
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But it's exactly the same mistake as the supposed "starve the beast" policy. If someone really doesn't trust the government to spend money on the right programs, then they shouldn't expect that reducing tax revenue will make the government prioritize the same things they would. Besides, governments can produce very bad outcomes with almost no budget at all, since some of the worst things in life are free. If cops lik…

This speaks to my ongoing crusade to try inject pragmatism into the political conversation. There are far too many unintended consequences to this sloganeering that is used to stir up the populace. We need to get away from focusing on intent of a change and look at the practical effects of the change.

Perhaps you are familiar with (or would support) the idea behind futarchy, which is sometimes expressed as "Vote on Values, Bet on Beliefs":

http://mason.gmu.edu/~rhanson/futarchy.html

Re: Cops wanted to keep mass surveillance app secret; privacy advocates refused

#37

I find it less concerning that the police have this info, than the fact that it's just a random company providing it and presumably anybody with the cash to buy access could buy the same or equivalent system.

Yep, not long before any disgruntled ex, or any other bad actor could look up anyone and find out their everything. In fact, such an app might be what's needed to blow the lid off the whole thing.

>Yep, not long before any disgruntled ex, or any other bad actor could look up anyone and find out their everything.

Again. We've come full circle from the wide open Wild Wild Web to now, with silos & gatekeepers. For, you know, security.

Re: Cops wanted to keep mass surveillance app secret; privacy advocates refused

#38
post #35

Something I don't really understand. In my country, it is not even legal to sell/provide a piece of equipement/a service which enable people to communicate ... which cannot be spied on. As far as I know, it is the law.

And what you don't understand is how it got so bad in your country? Pervasive, always-on, and presumed surveillance that cannot be opted out of is not a healthy environment for anyone.

Re: Cops wanted to keep mass surveillance app secret; privacy advocates refused

#39

I believe I am not the only one here whose blood boils at such a news story. Thank you EFF for investigating this. My question is, what can we do to fight such oppressive surveillance mechanisms as individuals? Beyond the standard donation to EFF and such. In my rage I want to see the Fog Data Science people prosecuted and the police depts which unquestioningly used their product stripped of their post, but what powe…

The root problem here is the commercial exploitation of personal data. How can you deny law enforcement access to data that is, for all practical purposes, available to anyone?

The solution to this particular problem is political. The USA needs federal privacy laws.

Re: Cops wanted to keep mass surveillance app secret; privacy advocates refused

#40
post #10

The root of this investigation was the EFF. If you make tech money, you can toss $50 their way without any hesitation. https://supporters.eff.org/donate You'll get some cool swag and, more importantly, ensure that they continue their excellent work.

I haven’t followed them enough but is it possible to support them without supporting other charitable causes of a political persuasion I don’t support? I fully support everything directly related to their cause but it gets me very upset when charities are supporting other various agendas around gender/immigration for example that are unrelated to their main goal.

To twist a quote:

First, they'll come for gender/immigration, but you didn't say anything. Then they'll come for you and nobody will be left to say anything.

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