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Build your own web framework

vercel.com

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Re: Build your own web framework

#31

Post by rlyshw »

moojd wrote: post #5

This is a nice overview of modern front-end development but I'm constantly disappointed with what 'web framework' means in node-land. None of these things are strictly necessary when building a web app but authz/authn, user management, databases, server-side logic vs client-side logic, are pretty much always needed. When I see the phrase 'web framework' these are the things I am interested in seeing and they all seem…

Im building with featherjs[0] right now and I love it. Jwt, user handling, routing, and (most notably to me) real-time functionality is all built in. Probably the most rails-like backend framework I’ve worked with in Node so far.

[0] https://feathersjs.com/

Re: Build your own web framework

#32

Post by tomnipotent »

ushakov wrote: post #27
sebmellen wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The edge network of a Vercel/Netlify is very hard to replicate in cloud as a small startup.

you could use Fastly or AWS Cloudfront

Vercel makes app deployment a first-class citizen that's baked into the CDN. Fastly doesn't offer a Vercel/Netlify deploy feature, and AWS requires considerably more work to setup but can easily replicate.

Re: Build your own web framework

#33

Post by kylegill »

ushakov wrote: post #18
koluna wrote: post #13

The more I see these announcements, the more I wonder - what is the appeal of something like Vercel and the likes? On the surface it seems like AWS/GCP/Azure/whichever big cloud provider can replicate literally everything they build within their infrastructure quite easily. Why host your core infra in a BigCo cloud and then the site on Vercel?

Vercel is easy to use and comes with batteries the primary decision driver here is hype factor it’s just more fashionable to use Vercel than AWS much of web development today is like this

> Vercel is easy to use and comes with batteries

On our team, we deploy our web app through Vercel primarily because of this (maybe there is some hype factor bias in there too?..). Everything else we rely on runs on AWS. We don't necessarily need Vercel for any of the edge computing or serverless environments, but the experience of building, previewing, and deploying our app is FAR superior to AWS's Amplify offering because it just works.

Trialing Amplify for a few weeks led to a world of hurt, leftover build artifacts in our accounts, failed builds left and right, unreliable preview environments, etc.

Re: Build your own web framework

#35

Post by granshaw »

Kerrick wrote: post #12
moojd wrote: post #5

This is a nice overview of modern front-end development but I'm constantly disappointed with what 'web framework' means in node-land. None of these things are strictly necessary when building a web app but authz/authn, user management, databases, server-side logic vs client-side logic, are pretty much always needed. When I see the phrase 'web framework' these are the things I am interested in seeing and they all seem…

The only framework of that scale and quality I’ve found in node-land is Adonis [0]. It’s why I chose Adonis 5 for my latest product—it needed to be built in JS or TypeScript but I wanted the “batteries included” feel of Laravel or Rails. [0]: https://adonisjs.com/

It’s also the most rails like node framework (is it still?), which emphasizes DX, expressiveness, convention over configuration, etc

which in my book is a plus

Re: Build your own web framework

#36

Post by tannhaeuser »

moojd wrote: post #25
aliqot wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Until now I had not found an eloquent way to express that emotion, but you come close. Somewhere around the time node got very popular, I started to notice a lot of impeccably branded (is that the right word? trendy maybe?) websites with tutorials that used all the right buzzwords to get me interested. Once I'd step through the content, it'd be very low quality. Despite the smooth lines and round edges, a lot of them…

I am optimistic though. We are still in the early days of server-side javascript. It took 20 years for the greater php community to coalesce around a handful of quality libraries, frameworks, and solutions to things like user management instead of everyone rolling their own or using things like '$_GET["pass"] == "foo"' they they grabbed from a google search. Node is barely over a decade old. We are already seeing pat…

> early days of server-side javascript

Err ... Netscape's LiveWire introduced server-side Javascript in 1996 even before Java became widely used on the server side. The module convention, the (synchronous) core modules of Node.js, and its canonical http middleware API and express.js/Connect/JSGI is from the CommonJS initiative, a co-op of 2000's SSJS framework developers [1].

[1]: https://www.commonjs.org/

Re: Build your own web framework

#37

Post by shepherdjerred »

wmfiv wrote: post #2

I'm struggling with the idea that React is a primitive used to build a Web Framework.

I think it’s easier to consider when you look at the frameworks that provide React + some other features. Of course you could swap React with something else, or write your own rendering + state management.

I think it’s similar to how Java web servers often use the library Netty under the hood. Why re-solve a problem?

Re: Build your own web framework

#38

Post by BenoitEssiambre »

akmittal wrote: post #9
upupandup wrote: post #4

not sure how this differs with AWS, you can do more at less cost than Vercel

AWS is overwhelming for most of Developers. Also vercel is focusing on ease of deployment for front end, it is also zero config, you can just deploy nextjs, react, svelte, remix apps in matter of minutes. Which is impossible with AWS

I've started playing with AWS App Runner (https://aws.amazon.com/apprunner/) which makes things fairly simple. You just point to a github repo, tell it the build command and the run command and it will deploy your project in containers and even load balance and scale up automatically.

Now it's not fully baked yet. DNS configuration is broken if you want to use your own domain (see https://github.com/aws/apprunner-roadmap/issues/37 and https://github.com/aws/apprunner-roadmap/issues/65 ) but you can get around that by putting cloudFront in front with just a few more clicks (and you get the benefit of having some of your files cached if you want).

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