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Lofi Girl: YouTube sorry for taking down music stream

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Re: Lofi Girl: YouTube sorry for taking down music stream

#31

Post by toolz »

I wish these creators with other social media presence would use their platforms to move their audience to something besides youtube (they can even keep their youtube presence).

Content creators are the only ones with the power to build up a competing platform such that youtube has to stop hurting the creators or risk losing their monopoly status as the de-factor video hosting platform.

Imagine if this content creator chose an alternative and linked to it in this tweet and everyone else started doing similarly. At the rate youtube is harming content creators, doesn't seem like it'd take long before users instinctively checked the competitions site anytime content gets taken down which might eventually turn into overthrowing their monopoly if they don't fix their issues.

Re: Lofi Girl: YouTube sorry for taking down music stream

#32

Post by somehnguy »

code51 wrote: post #17
mirashii wrote: post #2

From a tweet: https://twitter.com/TeamYouTube/status/1546419223466999809#m > & thx for your patience as we sorted it out But they haven't really sorted it out, have they? False copyright strike claims have been plaguing creators for years. This is just another case of someone needing social media and a huge reach or an inside connection to Google employees to get human eyes on a situation and "resolve" it, with no re…

Exactly. Google is not paying my Admob money even after 5 months has passed (no violation, self-close of account) Through the Kafkaesque maze of non-existent Adsense support, my case (they say) finally got escalated to a payment person at Google. Yet, I didn't hear update for the past month. You can't ask anything about your case and you can't get any time projection on when you'll hear anything back. If you don't ha…

Adsense held my funds for 6+ years in a never ending loop of bank account not valid->can’t edit this bank account. Same kafkaesque maze of non-existent support. Beyond frustrating. One day it just suddenly let me fix the issue. No idea why.

Your point is spot on, if you don’t have a huge social media following you might as well be invisible. This has to change, hopefully via law. Because it isn’t just a google problem.

Re: Lofi Girl: YouTube sorry for taking down music stream

#33

Post by slillibri »

corrral wrote: post #7
tmountain wrote: post #5

It's a pretty terrible situation for folks that build their livelihood curating a channel to have to accept the risk that their channel could be taken down at any moment due to a false positive regarding copyright violation. Making matters worse, it sounds like there's no real recourse beyond taking your grievance onto social media and hoping your channel has enough clout to get Youtube's attention. In this case, it…

> Seems like there's gotta be a better way. Video "channels" should be like podcasts: hosting and discovery largely separate. Subscription, client-side. YouTube shouldn't exist.

In theory that would be great, but video is in general much larger than audio. There would be no way for many channels to even get started, given the costs involved. I expect most people getting started on YouTube would be driven out of business simply by the bandwidth costs alone.

Re: Lofi Girl: YouTube sorry for taking down music stream

#34

Post by corrral »

BudaDude wrote: post #8
buzzwords wrote: post #6

YT couldn't care less if creators are unhappy with anything at the moment. There is no real competition, so creators have to just deal with it. I hope for a real competition, where there will be a mass exodus.

This is becoming less true, TikTok is a major competitor. Yeah there is Youtube shorts, but its largely just reuploaded TikTok videos.

That's just trading one master for another. It'd degrade to be similarly bad. A podcast-like model would provide a lot more freedom—host anywhere, promote anywhere, with clients, not monopolist web platforms, controlling "subscriptions" and such.

Re: Lofi Girl: YouTube sorry for taking down music stream

#35

Post by jerjerjer »

aetherson wrote: post #26
mirashii wrote: post #2

From a tweet: https://twitter.com/TeamYouTube/status/1546419223466999809#m > & thx for your patience as we sorted it out But they haven't really sorted it out, have they? False copyright strike claims have been plaguing creators for years. This is just another case of someone needing social media and a huge reach or an inside connection to Google employees to get human eyes on a situation and "resolve" it, with no re…

They haven't sorted it out, but it's also fundamentally not really something that Google can sort out. They have a legal responsibility to respond to these copyright claims, with major penalties if they don't -- this is from DMCA and its successors, from an era of... I don't want to say "copyright maximalism," but something closer to copyright maximalism than the balance is today. We need to reform the legal responsi…

We just need to fine copyright holders who abuse the system. Currently they are free to file as many false DMCA notices as they want, with zero drawbacks or consequences or costs for the filer and the burgen of proof on their victims.

If every false DMCA notice resulted in a fine for copyright holder, or even better, filing X false DMCA notices resulted in a copyright holder's ban from filing more DMCA notices, then I think the problem would resolve itself in short order.

Re: Lofi Girl: YouTube sorry for taking down music stream

#36

Post by code51 »

duped wrote: post #27
code51 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Google is not paying my Admob money even after 5 months has passed (no violation, self-close of account) Through the Kafkaesque maze of non-existent Adsense support, my case (they say) finally got escalated to a payment person at Google. Yet, I didn't hear update for the past month. You can't ask anything about your case and you can't get any time projection on when you'll hear anything back. If you don't ha…

Have you tried hiring a lawyer to send a letter to their legal team?

I think the only letter the legal team expects through google-legal-support@google.com is a notice of sueing them. I really don't have the power to sue them in a US court.

Do people have success when they notify (not sue) the legal team about Google acting against their Terms of Service?

Re: Lofi Girl: YouTube sorry for taking down music stream

#37

Post by richbell »

aetherson wrote: post #26
mirashii wrote: post #2

From a tweet: https://twitter.com/TeamYouTube/status/1546419223466999809#m > & thx for your patience as we sorted it out But they haven't really sorted it out, have they? False copyright strike claims have been plaguing creators for years. This is just another case of someone needing social media and a huge reach or an inside connection to Google employees to get human eyes on a situation and "resolve" it, with no re…

They haven't sorted it out, but it's also fundamentally not really something that Google can sort out. They have a legal responsibility to respond to these copyright claims, with major penalties if they don't -- this is from DMCA and its successors, from an era of... I don't want to say "copyright maximalism," but something closer to copyright maximalism than the balance is today. We need to reform the legal responsi…

> They haven't sorted it out, but it's also fundamentally not really something that Google can sort out.

This isn't really true. The main grievance people have with Google is that they've automated _everything_ to the point where it's impossible to escalate to a real person. They enable this type of abuse because they make it easy for people to abuse the DMCA system with impunity.

Even massive channels and companies have a hard time fighting back. A recent example: https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2022/03/bungie-slams-you...

Re: Lofi Girl: YouTube sorry for taking down music stream

#38

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

jerjerjer wrote: post #35
aetherson wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They haven't sorted it out, but it's also fundamentally not really something that Google can sort out. They have a legal responsibility to respond to these copyright claims, with major penalties if they don't -- this is from DMCA and its successors, from an era of... I don't want to say "copyright maximalism," but something closer to copyright maximalism than the balance is today. We need to reform the legal responsi…

We just need to fine copyright holders who abuse the system. Currently they are free to file as many false DMCA notices as they want, with zero drawbacks or consequences or costs for the filer and the burgen of proof on their victims. If every false DMCA notice resulted in a fine for copyright holder, or even better, filing X false DMCA notices resulted in a copyright holder's ban from filing more DMCA notices, then…

I agree with this.

I have heard that some folks use DMCA as, basically, a "protection racket." Not sure why they would do that, because there are probably easier (and less risky) ways.

But, as long as there's no penalty for filing a false DMCA claim, there's nothing stopping the "blunderbuss approach," which is hugely popular, with lawyers.

Re: Lofi Girl: YouTube sorry for taking down music stream

#39

Post by code51 »

somehnguy wrote: post #32
code51 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. Google is not paying my Admob money even after 5 months has passed (no violation, self-close of account) Through the Kafkaesque maze of non-existent Adsense support, my case (they say) finally got escalated to a payment person at Google. Yet, I didn't hear update for the past month. You can't ask anything about your case and you can't get any time projection on when you'll hear anything back. If you don't ha…

Adsense held my funds for 6+ years in a never ending loop of bank account not valid->can’t edit this bank account. Same kafkaesque maze of non-existent support. Beyond frustrating. One day it just suddenly let me fix the issue. No idea why. Your point is spot on, if you don’t have a huge social media following you might as well be invisible. This has to change, hopefully via law. Because it isn’t just a google proble…

6+ years... wow.

I'm afraid I'll end up like this:

- unable to use Adsense/Admob for years

- and not getting the money

- money becomes basically nothing because of inflation

Re: Lofi Girl: YouTube sorry for taking down music stream

#40

Post by _23sd »

The abuse of this system is only going to get worse as high profile cases like Bungie's [1] highlight how exploitable it is, even against big companies. It seems to me, as an outsider to YouTube's systems, that the system of "copyright strikes" (which is not prescribed by the DMCA, it's a more recent demand concocted by MPAA and RIAA lawyers) has caused a lot of harm to good faith creators while determined infringers simply make a new account when one gets banned. Is there any real helpful effect of using strikes that copyright owners couldn't get from just taking action on individual videos?

[1] https://torrentfreak.com/digital-trails-how-bungie-identifie...

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