New California law requires high schools to start later • Hacker News Board

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#31

Post by least » Fri, Jul 01, 2022, 8:40 PM UTC

synergy20 wrote: post #21

I never understand the schedule for schools: 1. elementary school starts at 7:30AM, middle school at 8:20, high school at 9:10 here. So, the youngest kid gets up at 6:50AM, older ones at 7:50AM, oldest at 8:40(assuming you're not too far from school that is). why the youngest ended up getting up the earliest puzzles me. 2. School is off in hot summer and cold winter, I would prefer they study on campus then, so they…

> why the youngest ended up getting up the earliest puzzles me.

I think there's been quite a few studies indicating that teenagers benefit the most from later start times due to the shift in their internal clock. Little kids can deal with earlier start times.

Staggered start is frequently due to logistics; they don't want to pay for a larger fleet of school buses and drivers to facilitate the schools starting at the same time.

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#32

Post by iso1631 » Fri, Jul 01, 2022, 8:40 PM UTC

giantg2 wrote: post #10

givemeethekeys wrote: post #4

8:30 or later. Good. I say start it at 10. Let the kids sleep in and be happier for it.

Ten sounds like a nightmare for working parents. Eight seems like a completely reasonable start time to me, yet this law prevents that. Schools should be able to decide for themselves based off of the parents and what works for those in the district.

Why? We're talking high schools - which I believe in the US is about age 15 onwards, nothing to do with parents

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#33

Post by dwighttk » Fri, Jul 01, 2022, 8:40 PM UTC

baby wrote: post #11

httpz wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That won't work for young kids if the parents have to go to work by 9.

let's make people start work later!

Mandatory blue laws before 9am!

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#34

Post by msbarnett » Fri, Jul 01, 2022, 8:41 PM UTC

Barrera wrote: post #28

> “We know that teenagers are the most sleep-deprived age group, and the cause is our own public policy,” said Joy Wake, who helped lead the efforts of the “Start School Later” group in California. I really doubt that. Sleep deprivation comes in large part from online behavior (source: personal anecdotes). Whether or not anyone wants to talk about that is another matter. The new law is unlikely to change the sleep-de…

> Sleep deprivation comes in large part from online behavior

Longitudinal studies observing that teenage circadian rhythms shift towards sleeping in later long predate "online behavior".

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#35

Post by alistairSH » Fri, Jul 01, 2022, 8:41 PM UTC

giantg2 wrote: post #18

MBlume wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If a high schooler needs to be driven to school by their parent, there is a serious street safety/transit problem which should be solved.

I think the bigger issue is unsupervised minors. Not all high schoolers are mature enough to be left alone and go to school. I suppose this could be solved by pre-care, but that make this bill completely moot.

We’re talking about a pretty small window of time. 2 hours at most. And a kid who’s going to willfully skip school is going to do so whether or not school starts at 8:30 instead of 7:30.

In most cases, this should work out better for parents. With elementary school starting latest (as was the norm in many places a decade ago), the little kids end up in pre-care AND after-care. Now, they’ll start earlier, possibly avoiding pre-care.

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#36

Post by bluGill » Fri, Jul 01, 2022, 8:41 PM UTC

guelo wrote: post #23

giantg2 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ten sounds like a nightmare for working parents. Eight seems like a completely reasonable start time to me, yet this law prevents that. Schools should be able to decide for themselves based off of the parents and what works for those in the district.

Don't working parents already have a nightmare with school day ending around 2pm? This would just shift some of that nightmare from afternoon to morning.

They already have daycare picking the kids up. Now they have to drop the kids off, and the kids can't really do anything at daycare because they are quickly getting into the bus to get to school, then when off school there is less time to do anything before their parents pick them up again.

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#37

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Jul 01, 2022, 8:41 PM UTC

Barrera wrote: post #28

> “We know that teenagers are the most sleep-deprived age group, and the cause is our own public policy,” said Joy Wake, who helped lead the efforts of the “Start School Later” group in California. I really doubt that. Sleep deprivation comes in large part from online behavior (source: personal anecdotes). Whether or not anyone wants to talk about that is another matter. The new law is unlikely to change the sleep-de…

[deleted]

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#38

Post by giantg2 » Fri, Jul 01, 2022, 8:41 PM UTC

gnopgnip wrote: post #22

giantg2 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ten sounds like a nightmare for working parents. Eight seems like a completely reasonable start time to me, yet this law prevents that. Schools should be able to decide for themselves based off of the parents and what works for those in the district.

But if all schools have to start later, employers will need to work around that

Some might. I bet many won't. Good luck doing business with the east coast if your office doesn't open until 11 am pacific.

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#39

Post by InefficientRed » Fri, Jul 01, 2022, 8:42 PM UTC

synergy20 wrote: post #21

I never understand the schedule for schools: 1. elementary school starts at 7:30AM, middle school at 8:20, high school at 9:10 here. So, the youngest kid gets up at 6:50AM, older ones at 7:50AM, oldest at 8:40(assuming you're not too far from school that is). why the youngest ended up getting up the earliest puzzles me. 2. School is off in hot summer and cold winter, I would prefer they study on campus then, so they…

> why the youngest ended up getting up the earliest puzzles me.

I've always heard teenagers need more sleep than younger kids. I've never actually verified this claim.

In my area it's the opposite, and the reason is simple: high schoolers don't need childcare.

> School is off in hot summer and cold winter, I would prefer they study on campus then, so they can enjoy longer break in spring and fall, where outdoor weather is much better to get around.

That's a pure anachronism, but switching costs are genuinely high so not totally irrational.

Re: New California law requires high schools to start later

#40

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Jul 01, 2022, 8:42 PM UTC

synergy20 wrote: post #21

I never understand the schedule for schools: 1. elementary school starts at 7:30AM, middle school at 8:20, high school at 9:10 here. So, the youngest kid gets up at 6:50AM, older ones at 7:50AM, oldest at 8:40(assuming you're not too far from school that is). why the youngest ended up getting up the earliest puzzles me. 2. School is off in hot summer and cold winter, I would prefer they study on campus then, so they…

[deleted]