The need for world government • Hacker News Board

Re: The need for world government

#31

Post by zthrowaway » Sun, Jun 26, 2022, 11:10 AM UTC

ultim8k wrote: post #17

inglor_cz wrote: post #15

"It seems obvious to me that planetary problems demand planetary government." That does not seem obvious to me at all. And I can't imagine a common set of governing principles acceptable to Iceland, China, Russia and the Taliban. For example, looking at what is currently rocking the U.S., what would be the global policy on abortion?

Abortion should be a human right. All countries that don’t respect that should pay huge fines. Thanks for giving that example.

Many don’t believe this is a human right, and you enforcing this on them is going against their will. This is authoritarian.

Re: The need for world government

#32

Post by chii » Sun, Jun 26, 2022, 11:10 AM UTC

oifjsidjf wrote: post #25

1) If you centralize everything into one government: what if that one government becomes corrupt? Then you cannot run to any other governments. 2) Cultural differences will require that different populations operate and behave differently, you will never be able to put the same constraints on different cultures.

> Cultural differences will require that different populations operate and behave differently

so you have local/regional government, responsible for local and regional policies. But global policies would be controlled by a global gov't.

Re: The need for world government

#33

Post by raydiatian » Sun, Jun 26, 2022, 11:11 AM UTC

I recently read Ray Dalio’s Principles of The Changing World Order. He essentially claimed that at the scale of world governments, man’s capacity to operate an intergovernmental social contract is non-existent. It is not without an effort to make it so, it’s just that unless there is a bigger fish defining the rules of the game are fair, we sort of brush up against Darwinian nature. Essentially, if a nation possesses some opportunity but doesn’t possess the means to defend it, it belongs to whichever nation is strong enough to come and take it.

Also, Max Tegmark’s Life 3.0 book has a fascinating fictional story about a company that uses AI to drive a new world order, back towards the center. It is both exceptionally hand-wavey but also not entirely unbelievable.

Not necessarily trying to make a point or anything, just thoughts that this article reminded me of.

Re: The need for world government

#34

Post by herodoturtle » Sun, Jun 26, 2022, 11:11 AM UTC

oifjsidjf wrote: post #25

1) If you centralize everything into one government: what if that one government becomes corrupt? Then you cannot run to any other governments. 2) Cultural differences will require that different populations operate and behave differently, you will never be able to put the same constraints on different cultures.

Centralised government and democracy are not mutually exclusive.

Re: The need for world government

#35

Post by h2odragon » Sun, Jun 26, 2022, 11:11 AM UTC

ultim8k wrote: post #17

inglor_cz wrote: post #15

"It seems obvious to me that planetary problems demand planetary government." That does not seem obvious to me at all. And I can't imagine a common set of governing principles acceptable to Iceland, China, Russia and the Taliban. For example, looking at what is currently rocking the U.S., what would be the global policy on abortion?

Abortion should be a human right. All countries that don’t respect that should pay huge fines. Thanks for giving that example.

Until when? I advocate parental "take backs" up til the kid's 18, but some think I'm a bit extreme.

I don't think forcing my opinion on anyone who disagrees is correct, but then neither do I want others' opinions forced on me.

Re: The need for world government

#36

Post by barry-cotter » Sun, Jun 26, 2022, 11:11 AM UTC

ultim8k wrote: post #17

inglor_cz wrote: post #15

"It seems obvious to me that planetary problems demand planetary government." That does not seem obvious to me at all. And I can't imagine a common set of governing principles acceptable to Iceland, China, Russia and the Taliban. For example, looking at what is currently rocking the U.S., what would be the global policy on abortion?

Abortion should be a human right. All countries that don’t respect that should pay huge fines. Thanks for giving that example.

This is why one world government will happen at the barrel of a gun, if ever.

Re: The need for world government

#37

Post by snidane » Sun, Jun 26, 2022, 11:12 AM UTC

World government makes sense so that coverage of responsibility would be extended over all common areas such as air and oceans. With decentralised govt there is no owner of oceans, it's a common pasture, so nobody prevents certain countries from hunting down all the whales until extinction and poor countries making ocean a dumpster for plastics that rich green countries recycled their plastics to.

However, world government doesn't make sense before more planets are settled, because no governent model is perfect yet and the best model we have so far is a competition between states as to which model should prevail.

Eg., you are a monarchy and your next king is a moron. Too bad, having democracy would have made this only temporary. You are a democracy and your country's media run by oligarchs found a way to rule by influencing masses. Too bad, if you had a king, he would imprison the oligarchs.

There will be cycles in model of government in foreseeable future, so it is premature to decide on the one government style yet, so it is dangerous to do one and only world govt yet. Wait for Musk to colonize Mars at least.

Re: The need for world government

#38

Post by lifeformed » Sun, Jun 26, 2022, 11:14 AM UTC

zthrowaway wrote: post #31

ultim8k wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Abortion should be a human right. All countries that don’t respect that should pay huge fines. Thanks for giving that example.

Many don’t believe this is a human right, and you enforcing this on them is going against their will. This is authoritarian.

Against their will to do what? Legalizing abortion doesn't mean forced abortions.

Re: The need for world government

#39

Post by bilvar » Sun, Jun 26, 2022, 11:14 AM UTC

telmo wrote: post #20

usrn wrote: post #3

Based on how the EU and UN worked out a world government sounds like a disaster.

What do you mean? Nothing is perfect but the EU has been a net positive for its member states. It is approved of by a majority of its citizens across all countries. The EU created one of the most prosperous (for the common person), free and tolerant societies on earth. You can make all the snarky remarks you want, but if you were reincarnating right now as some random human and you learned that you reincarnated as a…

Have you asked anyone not German or French what do they think about living in the EU? I’m sure it’s turned out great for Germany and their lap dog, but let’s ask the Spanish, the Italians and especially the Greek and have this conversation again.

Re: The need for world government

#40

Post by freedom2099 » Sun, Jun 26, 2022, 11:14 AM UTC

zthrowaway wrote: post #31

ultim8k wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Abortion should be a human right. All countries that don’t respect that should pay huge fines. Thanks for giving that example.

Many don’t believe this is a human right, and you enforcing this on them is going against their will. This is authoritarian.

Authoritarian is forcing a mother to have a child she doesn’t want! It’s her body! If you force your opinion on something that should be exclusively her concern then you are the “authoritarian”