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Science Is Getting Harder

mattsclancy.substack.com

31–40 of 150 posts

Re: Science Is Getting Harder

#31
The Scientific Method, as classically defined, is a process of reducing a potential problem space to a single variable and testing it six ways to Sunday to prove to yourself and others that you aren't just imagining things. I don't think it's an accident that physics and chemistry are far ahead of psychology and biology. Both are emergent behaviors and emergent behaviors are notoriously difficult to lock down to a single variable. I've been wondering for a while now if we are just running out of 'simple' problems to test and running out of techniques for simplifying problems. That at some point there is only hard stuff left, even by a contemporary definition of "hard".

I just want to state this as context, not as an invitation to tangent into an argument: I think general purpose AI is going to fade from consumer software again, as it has so many times before. But I suspect that some of the tools may find a home in areas where all of the problems are multivariate, and things like advanced techniques in linear algebra can help find signals in the noise when you can't control an environment.

I recall years ago someone discovering that chemo works better on an empty stomach, and not just for the obvious reason of not having anything to throw up. Normal cells in "starvation mode" absorb toxins slower, while many tumors ignore this signal. If we can nail down things like "If you have these genes and your serum vitamin D is > 120 and you fast for >8 hours and ingest 20-40 mg of caffeine an hour before infusion, tumor shrinking is increased by 40%" by mining through mountains of telemetry and then working backward from there to find the causal link.

Re: Science Is Getting Harder

#32
post #5

> A basket of indicators all seem to document a trend similar to what we see with technology. Even as the number of scientists and publications rises substantially, we do not appear to be seeing a concomitant rise in new discoveries that supplant older ones. Science is getting harder. Nothing worth doing is easy. We have cleared the low hanging fruit and can now do the actual work. This is so exciting :) (also I wond…

> Nothing worth doing is easy. Breathing is pretty easy. But more seriously, I think what you said only applies in iterations of revolutions. A new breakthrough (e.g. new physics, new invention) could create a lot more low hanging fruit.

> I think what you said only applies in iterations of revolutions

I think a major problem is ever since general relativity, all of our (existing and potential) new revolutions are very abstract and hard to relate back to human perception.

Take dark matter/energy for example - if we get a better model to understand that, it will revolutionize how we think about the universe, but it will (hopefully) have less impact on day-to-day society than the nuclear model of atoms did.

Re: Science Is Getting Harder

#33
Some of these measures are not really convincing, most obvious Nobel prices/paper, the rate of Nobel prices/year is fixed so when the number of papers goes up, the rate of publications that get a Nobel goes down.

Re: Science Is Getting Harder

#34

Sorry if this sounds elitist to anyone but (I guess it is): When the R&D workforce expands at the rate it has over the last few decades you will invariably see less talented and less talented people entering the field. Also, various forms of overhead will grow with the size of the workforce. As an example about 20 people attended the 1911 Solvay Conference on Physics. How many attend a conference today? With the grow…

> ... the most destructive force in any human endeavor: politics. I imagine you were being tongue-in-cheek, but just to unreasonably latch onto that statement a bit: politics is certainly infuriating, and it's easy to treat it as some unalloyed Bad Thing that we wish would just go away, but politics is essentially communication, and so it can be a good thing, too. The bigger the group, the more communication you need…

Imagine we somehow were able to purge all political and media influence, past and present, from the minds of each person today. And then had them rank the issues they find most relevant in the world. Where do you think the things people today spend all their time politicking on would rank? Similarly imagine they wrote out their 'oughts' of what the world ought look like in their eyes. How much overlap do you think there would be with the political platforms of today?

Of course we can only speculate, but to me it seems self evident that there would be effectively 0 overlap. The issue is that politics invariably turns into a viral team sport where people pick some side, adopt that side's views wholesale, convince themselves they're the most important thing ever, and then set out to convert everybody else to their team, beat the other teams in any way possible, and of course always fanatically cheer on their own team regardless of whether or not its deserved.

And then when things get hot enough, you get violence. Politics is precisely what started WW1. An otherwise irrelevant Archduke was assassinated and then that politically snowballed into everybody killing everybody everywhere, because politics. Then we chose to engage in extreme political myopia imposing absolutely harsh punishments on the losers of the war which, shockingly enough, didn't really lead to them rejoining the "world order" but instead declaring war on it again, and nearly winning.

And the only reason we haven't yet had WW3 is nuclear weapons. War doesn't really work when you can guarantee that your country (and you, for that matter) will most likely not exist at the end, "win" or lose. But now political frenzies are overriding even that most basic aspect of self preservation and inching us closer to WW3 than we've ever been. So no, I do not think he was being tongue in cheek.

Re: Science Is Getting Harder

#35

When was it easy? So much early discovery has been binned or replaced; easy answers were wrong. It took hundreds of years of effort to bubble up relativity and information theory. When was this golden age in the past when the world was magically easier and “better”? I see complaints about social media brainwashing people but what is religion and nation state populism? I have a hard time taking contemporary opinions o…

I do think it is getting harder, but that is not necessarily bad at all. One big bottleneck in science is the technology to do experiments. A lot of the discoveries that required lower tech are for the most part over, now we need some serious technology to make discoveries. Hubble has its limits, so we need the James Webb Telescope. Einstein predicted gravitational waves, but it took almost 100 years to develop the technology of LIGO and get it up and running to run the experiments. Also, the technology needed is also insanely more expensive. Newton needed time, pen, paper to writes hit laws of motion. Now we need satellites out at the L2 point that can be put in place remotely since it may be awhile before people can swing by and make repairs or troubleshoot physically.

Maybe just spit balling. Maybe it isn't that science has gotten harder, but science needs more engineering support than what it currently has to develop the technologies to allow more a more rapid discovery.

Re: Science Is Getting Harder

#36
This is especially true in math and physics. You will find that no matter what problem you can think of, either it has already been solved to the highest level of abstraction, or it's an unsolved and famous problem, or not worthwhile/trivial. Like, what about analogous of elliptic functions for non-elliptic integrals? already been done. The past century has seen a huge explosion of research into STEM subjects, from math, to physics, to biology, to computer science, etc.. Tens of billions of people people ever lived since the 1800s, and even just a tiny, tiny fraction of them are doing research, is still a huge amount of output. There just isn't much new ground to break, so this means discoveries will either be much more incremental or require considerably more mental horsepower.

Psychology is sorta the opposite: there is no limit to the number of experiments you can run on people or possible associations between causes and effects. It's not like psychology , literature, philosophy, or history has gotten harder over the past century, unlike math, physics, or economics. Sure, there are more advanced statistical methods, but running experiments hasn't gotten harder. This is also why the vast majority of physicists and mathematicians are teachers rather than researchers, and why econ papers have gotten much longer and are full of dense stats methods. There are always going to be new discoveries in biology and medicine, and same for applied math and applied physics, such as engineering or astronomy, but theoretical math and probably also theoretical physics are as saturated as can be.

Re: Science Is Getting Harder

#37
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nothing worth doing is easy. Breathing is pretty easy. But more seriously, I think what you said only applies in iterations of revolutions. A new breakthrough (e.g. new physics, new invention) could create a lot more low hanging fruit.

> I think what you said only applies in iterations of revolutions I think a major problem is ever since general relativity, all of our (existing and potential) new revolutions are very abstract and hard to relate back to human perception. Take dark matter/energy for example - if we get a better model to understand that, it will revolutionize how we think about the universe, but it will (hopefully) have less impact on…

Hmm, I don't think that's something we can predict. Someone could have said the same thing before general relativity... in fact, most people did because they thought we were almost done.

Re: Science Is Getting Harder

#38
Having been long in academia, what has increased is commercialization of all kinds of science, number of science managers (like modern day billionaires, taking credit for the work actually done by the graduate students and postdocs, growing to be huge), number of politicians putting their names in various papers (I see managers co-authoring on average a paper per week), brutal competition for status and citations, excellent writing and formalism with little or no substance, rise of administrators with large incomes, gangs and tribes accepting each other grants and papers, intensified politics on awards/recognitions/invited talks and control of main publications, people constantly chasing the same topical subjects for grants and industry relevance, and similar activities. The science component has actually decreased in my view. The system and practices sometimes remind me of the Wall Street, with the currency being fame.

I don’t think this system will last for too long. The environment is increasingly filled with status hungry people. Balaji has a good prediction on that.

Re: Science Is Getting Harder

#39

Sorry if this sounds elitist to anyone but (I guess it is): When the R&D workforce expands at the rate it has over the last few decades you will invariably see less talented and less talented people entering the field. Also, various forms of overhead will grow with the size of the workforce. As an example about 20 people attended the 1911 Solvay Conference on Physics. How many attend a conference today? With the grow…

But it seems like if you're making the argument that science is getting harder, then raw numbers should matter more than percentages. From the article: "I’m claiming that science is getting harder, in the sense that it is increasingly challenging to make discoveries that have comparable impact to the ones in the past". So, unless you're arguing that there aren't an equivalent 20 people alive today as prestigious as t…

I think discoveries of equivalent impact are being made, but not in physics laboratories. Looking back at the current century I think it will be clear that the most impactful discoveries / inventions were related to information processing and that they were made in the private sector.

Re: Science Is Getting Harder

#40

Sorry if this sounds elitist to anyone but (I guess it is): When the R&D workforce expands at the rate it has over the last few decades you will invariably see less talented and less talented people entering the field. Also, various forms of overhead will grow with the size of the workforce. As an example about 20 people attended the 1911 Solvay Conference on Physics. How many attend a conference today? With the grow…

> 1911 Solvay Conference on Physics

The Solvay conference was invite only, but I think your point still stands.

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