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The ‘Form’ Element Created the Modern Web. Was It a Big Mistake?

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Re: The ‘Form’ Element Created the Modern Web. Was It a Big Mistake?

#31

Journalists can't write about something like the element without talking about Elon Musks' tweets. It's an unhealthy obsession and I'm kinda sick of hearing about it.

He's got a love-to-hate personality who is able to capture the limelight of journalist. This makes him seem like a firebrand to suckers who love him. They play off each other, making him into a massively famous celebrity.

Re: The ‘Form’ Element Created the Modern Web. Was It a Big Mistake?

#32
post #19

I think the form field certainly influenced the particular technical evolution path the web and internet took, but I also think it's not the reason we have social networks or e-commerce. Those were extremely compelling usecases even before the web and I don't think any particular technology was the reason, they got so big. That was probably more due to economic or social factors. My guess is even without the form fie…

You can see the same dynamic on precursor systems. Half the complexity in ANSI escape codes for dumb terminals exists to provide form support (and some features added to terminals like ‘terminal status report’ exist to make forms easier to implement). The French Minicom system was built to deliver interactive forms over the phone line to terminals in people’s homes; in the UK there was the similar Prestel, which was mainly used for commercial UIs (huge in the travel industry), and which was basically ‘teletext plus form fields’.

Heck, even print technology implemented ‘forms’ technology - there is a standard UX affordance of a dotted line with scissors drawn on it to tell you that a piece of printed material supports cutting out a form, filling it and mailing it in. These forms were showing up in magazines, on cereal packets, back for over a century… the catalog industry was built on this tech.

Basically, if you create an information distribution medium, someone will turn it into a form delivery platform. It’s inevitable.

Re: The ‘Form’ Element Created the Modern Web. Was It a Big Mistake?

#33
This is one of the most vacuous articles I have come across in quite some time, all wrapped up in rhetoric and presented as if it were some profound insight. It's not. Not only does it get the tech details wrong (POST allowed read/write capability pretty much from the beginning, wasn't the start of it) but it would be equally accurate-- and useless-- to point to the keyboard as the culprit. Or taking a step outside of tech, complain that human hearts are the #1 cause of heart attacks & nerves as the arch-villain behind all physical pain.

I kept reading, thinking that there must be something somewhere that would tie things together in any meaningful way, but nope, nothing. It could be transplanted to The Onion with only a few modifications and fit much better there as some type of absurdist piece of humour.

Re: The ‘Form’ Element Created the Modern Web. Was It a Big Mistake?

#34

If HTML didn't have a tag, then HTML and the web would still be a fairly marginal technology, and something else most likely would have existed where all these problems occurred. Maybe we'd all be complaining about how IRC is radicalizing people or something. A repository full of static documents isn't really all that interesting. That's basically a library on a computer. Even in the very earliest days of the web, pe…

Right, this is exactly what happened to Gopher and FTP. They were good at their one job. They were replaced by HTTP.

Re: The ‘Form’ Element Created the Modern Web. Was It a Big Mistake?

#35

If HTML didn't have a tag, then HTML and the web would still be a fairly marginal technology, and something else most likely would have existed where all these problems occurred. Maybe we'd all be complaining about how IRC is radicalizing people or something. A repository full of static documents isn't really all that interesting. That's basically a library on a computer. Even in the very earliest days of the web, pe…

No post body was provided.

Re: The ‘Form’ Element Created the Modern Web. Was It a Big Mistake?

#36
> If people evolved like technology, you’d be 6,000 lizards, 30 chimps, and a couple Neanderthals all glued together with an anguished human face stretched across it as a “visual refresh.”

Well, actually there's still quite some old DNA in our genes, and we still go through various past forms as an embryo. Also we still got a tailbone despite not having a tail anymore, and a lot of similar cruft.

Re: The ‘Form’ Element Created the Modern Web. Was It a Big Mistake?

#38

Paul Ford must spend a non-negligible amount of time sitting around thinking: “What’s the dumbest thing I could get Wired or Bloomberg to publish?” And to be absolutely pedantic: He shouldn’t be mad about forms and inputs, they can be used with the read-only web (GET params) and have client-side only uses (calculations.) Given what he’s trying to say, the headline should be: “The ‘HTTP POST’ Method Created the Modern…

Unfortunately, that's the state of much of digital journalism. The incentives (clicks) are simply not aligned with journalistic quality.

Re: The ‘Form’ Element Created the Modern Web. Was It a Big Mistake?

#39
Form element?

To quote the late great Douglas Adams, "Many were increasingly of the opinion that they'd all made a big mistake in coming down from the trees in the first place. And some said that even the trees had been a bad move, and that no one should ever have left the oceans."

Re: The ‘Form’ Element Created the Modern Web. Was It a Big Mistake?

#40
post #11

>THE WEB WAS born to publish documents—in particular, physics papers from CERN, the great laboratory where Tim Berners-Lee, [...] I have argued many times, to the despair of anyone within range, that the element was a pivot point for the entire technology industry. It is what changed the web from a read-only medium for physics papers into a read-write medium for anything. Tim Berners-Lee also invented the HTTP protoc…

>HTTP 1.0 had the "POST" method and HTPP 1.1 added "PUT". So the read-write capability of the web was there from the beginning.

HTTP 0.9 (1991) only had GET. HTTP 1.0 is from 1996.

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