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Wozniak remembers Steve Jobs

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Re: Wozniak remembers Steve Jobs

#31

Post by rbanffy »

ajross wrote: post #29
rbanffy wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> the Apple II simply had no "user experience" in the sense we understand today Of course there is an user experience element on an Apple II. You just have to put the II in the context of the microcomputers if its time. It came in a plastic box, you could hook up your TV and you could display color and make music and sound effects in the speaker. You turned it on and you got a BASIC language interpreter instantly. Yo…

I guess this is true, but it's seems like a needless digression. Woz did all that stuff. The power-on prompts (both monitor and BASIC) were his. TV output certainly wasn't a Jobs innovation (nor was it Woz's, he just did it better with a staggeringly low part count). My point earlier was that attributing this to Jobs purely because of an intuition that "Jobs does UX" is incorrect, and speaks more broadly to my point…

> Woz did all that stuff.

While I agree the II is not a Jobs-only product, I can't imagine Jobs sitting quietly letting Woz make all the decisions. I can't picture Jobs sitting quietly at all.

Re: Wozniak remembers Steve Jobs

#32

Post by j45 »

robertleeper7 wrote: post #30

A wonderful video - best thing I seen about Steve's passing. Woz is right. The dynamic of the two is what made Apple great. It's a classic case of a partnership that works with the sum being greater than the whole. Design (vision x moxie) + Ability (brains x sweat) = Great. And let's not forget the countless unsung worker bees who actually make it all happen. Viva Apple! His best line is about how entrepreneurs (like…

While this is about Steve Jobs, it was amazing how 1+1=11 with the two of them together.

I have often wished that Woz continued to design products with Apple long after he left. What if he had been there with Steve all this time?

If Woz invented the personal computer for the masses (Apple I, II, and building the Macintosh before Steve Jobs joined the team), what other unknown potential hasn't happened yet?

The other interesting thing is where Steve Jobs was seen as aloof and business minded, Steve Wozniak more than made up for it with heart.

A healthy, hearty and brainy balance if I may say.

Re: Wozniak remembers Steve Jobs

#33

Post by brianobush »

ajross wrote: post #18
vecter wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe we're talking past each other. It would be ridiculous to claim that Steve would've said "Woz, you should consider this design pattern or abstraction to solve that problem you're having". I imagine it would have been more general points about the user experience he hoped for.

But that's the thing: the Apple II simply had no "user experience" in the sense we understand today. You turned it on and got an Integer BASIC prompt (or the monitor). That software was a stripped down version of BASICs that existed elsewhere, not something meaningfully "improved" by Apple (except in the sense of running amazingly well in 8kb of RAM) it was hand written (hand assembled I believe) by Woz. Eventually,…

All this talk makes me want to build a replica.... http://www.brielcomputers.com/replica1.html

If only to relive a bit of history.

Re: Wozniak remembers Steve Jobs

#34

Post by pietro »

ajross wrote: post #18
vecter wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe we're talking past each other. It would be ridiculous to claim that Steve would've said "Woz, you should consider this design pattern or abstraction to solve that problem you're having". I imagine it would have been more general points about the user experience he hoped for.

But that's the thing: the Apple II simply had no "user experience" in the sense we understand today. You turned it on and got an Integer BASIC prompt (or the monitor). That software was a stripped down version of BASICs that existed elsewhere, not something meaningfully "improved" by Apple (except in the sense of running amazingly well in 8kb of RAM) it was hand written (hand assembled I believe) by Woz. Eventually,…

Handwritten in machine code, according to this article: http://apple2history.org/history/ah16/#03

Re: Wozniak remembers Steve Jobs

#35

Post by dpark »

alanfalcon wrote: post #22

How terrible is it that the one to break the news to Woz was a reporter looking to get Woz's take?

I'm pretty sure this happens a lot. Reporters get word of famous persons's death and then frantically try to be the first to get a reaction from the deceased's family, friends, etc.

But yes, it's quite terrible.

Re: Wozniak remembers Steve Jobs

#36

Post by ww520 »

Apple IIgs was my first computer and 6502 assembly was my first computer language. Woz was an amazingly talented guy, though I remember I had a hard time dealing with the non-contiguous video memory that he came up with on Apple II.

Re: Wozniak remembers Steve Jobs

#37

Post by ww520 »

ajross wrote: post #11
JunkDNA wrote: post #6

Reminds me what an incredible guy Woz is as well. Makes me wish I could have been there as the two of them debated the future of the personal computer in their garage.

Not sure that would have been as enlightening as you think. They worked together on the Apple II, not the Mac. And the 6502 boxes were all Woz on the inside. His design, his software. Jobs added the box, the polish and the marketing. But all the look and feel wizardry and attention to detail was still in his future. Apple bootstrapped by selling a machine that was fundamentally the work of a single hacker. Edit: I sh…

Woz was the technical cofounder and Jobs was the business cofounder, in today lingo.

Re: Wozniak remembers Steve Jobs

#38

Post by LukeShu »

lawnchair_larry wrote: post #24
ajross wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that's the thing: the Apple II simply had no "user experience" in the sense we understand today. You turned it on and got an Integer BASIC prompt (or the monitor). That software was a stripped down version of BASICs that existed elsewhere, not something meaningfully "improved" by Apple (except in the sense of running amazingly well in 8kb of RAM) it was hand written (hand assembled I believe) by Woz. Eventually,…

It's amazing how humble Woz is about it too. Even after several incidents between the two that paint Jobs in fairly poor light (such as the "Woz Plan"), Woz has nothing but respect and admiration for him. I thought the first computer that Woz made had a mouse and GUI though ("borrowed" from Xerox PARC), am I remembering wrong? The Lisa was started in 1978 way before Woz left.

The first "computer" Woz made (and sold, I suppose) was the Apple I, which was actually a kit, just the motherboard. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_I

The first computer Woz made was the Apple II https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apple_II, which had no mouse or GUI, but could do graphics, which were mostly used by games. I suppose many programs for it used a TUI, a la VisiCalc.

Re: Wozniak remembers Steve Jobs

#39

Post by javert »

How does Woz saying that Steve Jobs was incredibly kind, sync up with the statment on Jobs' Wikipedia page that Jobs stole thousands of dollars from Woz when they were both at Atari [1]?

Is there something more to this story?

[1] search for $700 on Jobs' wikipedia page

Re: Wozniak remembers Steve Jobs

#40

Post by [deleted] »

javert wrote: post #39

How does Woz saying that Steve Jobs was incredibly kind, sync up with the statment on Jobs' Wikipedia page that Jobs stole thousands of dollars from Woz when they were both at Atari [1]? Is there something more to this story? [1] search for $700 on Jobs' wikipedia page

[deleted]
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