Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

IQ test for SW Eng interview?

news.ycombinator.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 41 posts

Re: IQ test for SW Eng interview?

#31

Post by thfuran »

djohnston wrote: post #30
langitbiru wrote: post #24

How to interview software engineers: - LeetCode (and other tests) - Homework assignments - Looking at pedigree (university) - Looking at experience (where you've been working) - Looking at portfolio (open source contribution) - Using gut feeling Each has its drawbacks. So what is the fairest way to interview software engineers? I guess, we should let software engineers pick their poison and start from there.

Of all these I think homework or portfolio is the most reasonable. I've almost never used leetcode style coding in my actual job, pedigree isn't indicative of much in my experience (all the best hackers I've known in 10 years and two continents are from eastern European state universities), and gut feeling is a coinflip.

Unless you also know a bunch of bad hackers from Eastern European state universities, it sounds like you're saying that pedigree is actually a great measure.

Re: IQ test for SW Eng interview?

#32

Post by thfuran »

duped wrote: post #8
Bostonian wrote: post #5

IQ tests have been shown to have predict performance in a wide range of jobs. There is a 2004 paper "General Mental Ability in the World of Work: Occupational Attainment and Job Performance" http://wminsk-shared-docs.s3.amazonaws.com/Schmidt_Hunter_20... .

That seems both obvious and irrelevant to hiring. In today's market you are less picking the best available person and trying to increase the number of people available for the position who are willing to take it. You never want to create a filter so small that no one can pass through it.

How could a test that is predictive of job performance possibly be irrelevant to hiring?

Re: IQ test for SW Eng interview?

#33

Post by JamesBarney »

duped wrote: post #27
JamesBarney wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Increasing the number of people available for a position doesn't help you hire a better candidate if you aren't able to effectively screen out candidates. I don't see why an IQ test creates a filter so small no one can pass through it. It's just one more data point.

It filters out people who wouldn't take it to begin with. I know I wouldn't continue with the process at a place that puts stock in one.

Not sure why you wouldn't want to take an IQ test, they don't strike me as any sillier than the multitude of other questions I've been asked for hiring.

Most places I've seen that use IQ tests usually hire from non traditional backgrounds. People without experience, bad GPAs etc...

Re: IQ test for SW Eng interview?

#34

Post by djohnston »

thfuran wrote: post #31
djohnston wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of all these I think homework or portfolio is the most reasonable. I've almost never used leetcode style coding in my actual job, pedigree isn't indicative of much in my experience (all the best hackers I've known in 10 years and two continents are from eastern European state universities), and gut feeling is a coinflip.

Unless you also know a bunch of bad hackers from Eastern European state universities, it sounds like you're saying that pedigree is actually a great measure.

You're right! I meant the typically preferred pedigree of top tier American schools

Re: IQ test for SW Eng interview?

#36

Post by logicalmonster »

I am not a lawyer, but given the Supreme Court case Griggs v. Duke Power Company, it’s kind of surprising that IQ would be a metric used by employers in America. Despite the validity of IQ as a tool, it seems legally dicey to me. You’re risking civil rights lawsuits, obviously.

As far as IQ tests as a concept, provided that it’s the only hoop that you’d have to jump through, I’d be game to chop through the interview process with one test and a short technical conversation to prove I have a tech background. The interview process is such a chore to wade through otherwise with BS homework assignments and recruiters who understand nothing trying to feel you out. It’s all much stupider than taking an IQ test to prove ability. I’d much rather take one test and be done with it.

Re: IQ test for SW Eng interview?

#38

Post by nowherebeen »

Bostonian wrote: post #5

IQ tests have been shown to have predict performance in a wide range of jobs. There is a 2004 paper "General Mental Ability in the World of Work: Occupational Attainment and Job Performance" http://wminsk-shared-docs.s3.amazonaws.com/Schmidt_Hunter_20... .

There's always someone pointing to some psychiatric study that it predicts some kind of future performance, despite the fact most of them can't be reproduced.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2018/08/27/6422183...

Out of all the subjects out there, I find psychiatric studies to be the most bullshit out of all of them. It's whatever you want it to be. I am sure if I was motivated, I would find another study that says the complete opposite.

I am a Mensan and even I find these IQ tests pointless and stupid.

Re: IQ test for SW Eng interview?

#39

Post by johntdaly »

JamesBarney wrote: post #18
johntdaly wrote: post #3

I honestly believe that HR in IT is so broken that just about nothing they do makes sense. Most interviews are BS, most coding interviews/tests are BS, an IQ test is BS too. I don’t think the IQ test is inherently worse or better that the other voodoo HR practices. A high IQ is something you can use to show a high probability of a candidate to “succeed” at his/her job but what is success? An IQ test can’t differentia…

It's better than other voodoo practices because it more accurately measures what is trying to measure. Your second paragraph is arguing that IT employers should be agnostic to how intelligent their devs are. That really didn't make sense to me. All things being equal I'd rather hire smarter devs.

I don’t think you understand my stance an intelligence or IQ tests the way I intended it.

I am just saying that having a high IQ (single measure of intelligence) doesn’t guaranty you that the person is skilled right for your job (multiple types of intelligence) and that the person might be so skilled that he/she is good in avoiding doing actual work and taking credit for the work of others.

I’ve worked with people like that, intelligent yes, but not a good programmer. Instead really good at sucking up towards the managers, getting others to help him and taking credit in the right way. An IQ test wouldn’t have washed him out.

Post reply on HN