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Fake vaccine cards are everywhere. It’s a public health nightmare

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Re: Fake vaccine cards are everywhere. It’s a public health nightmare

#31

Post by mathwords »

torstenvl wrote: post #19
cute_boi wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that a common knowledge, assuming vaccination means less hospitalization. So, why do we even need data in such case? Vaccine passports somehow forces or incentivizes people to vaccinate more?

No. Requiring vaccine passports or vaccine cards incentivizes people to get vaccine passports and/or vaccine cards , which is exactly what we're seeing. This is like counting lines of code or repo commits to see how productive a SWE is. If you want to incentivize X , you have to be very careful not to instead incentivize an imperfect proxy for X .

Same with the tests.

All it says is that the test said positive or negative. It in no way tells you anything about how bad your Covid is, how far along it is, and if you can spread it to others.

The tests are a last minute cash grab.

Stop getting tested and this thing ends. (However I know a bunch of folks who have to be tested anyway because they didn’t want to be boosted, despite getting the initial vax)

Re: Fake vaccine cards are everywhere. It’s a public health nightmare

#32

Post by all2 »

torstenvl wrote: post #19
cute_boi wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't that a common knowledge, assuming vaccination means less hospitalization. So, why do we even need data in such case? Vaccine passports somehow forces or incentivizes people to vaccinate more?

No. Requiring vaccine passports or vaccine cards incentivizes people to get vaccine passports and/or vaccine cards , which is exactly what we're seeing. This is like counting lines of code or repo commits to see how productive a SWE is. If you want to incentivize X , you have to be very careful not to instead incentivize an imperfect proxy for X .

We see the same misunderstanding in implemented taxes. Ever notice the ebb and flow of "that new alcoholic beverage" that seems to be popular for a time and then disappear? There were seltzers and wine coolers, etc. Each disappeared as soon as a tax was levied specifically against that beverage.

Likewise, Tennessee laws crushed a single kind of tow truck (called a "wrecker", I think) when they targeted a specific configuration of truck. What you see now is mostly tilt-bed tow trucks because the other kind of truck is more expensive to operate.

Money/access incentivizes people to change their habits. We are creatures that seek a minimal energy expenditure solution. If going to some website and filling in a pdf that generates an "ok" looking picture is required to retain access to a bar, people will do that.

Re: Fake vaccine cards are everywhere. It’s a public health nightmare

#33

Post by mikestew »

The "public health nightmare" is that such a thing is so easily faked, on top of the fact that no one looks anyway. Has anyone ever seen a QR code being scanned? No? Just wave a screenshot of your friend's digital vaccination record? Yeah, that works. Why even bother with fake cardboard representations? Post that screenshot (with the QR code replaced by a rickroll URL) to your Telegram channel, sorted.

But just now with the pearl-clutching? Because when they handed me my card almost a year ago, I almost didn't hang on to it because my first thought was, "well, no one is going to accept that as proof of vaccination. I could have photocopied it for all anyone knows." Turns out...

Re: Fake vaccine cards are everywhere. It’s a public health nightmare

#34

Post by ryandrake »

technothrasher wrote: post #17

Validating seems to be so lackluster that I'm not sure fake card producers are even an issue currently. Any time I've had to validate my vax status in order to get into some establishment, either a crappy photocopy or a digital photo of the card on my phone has been accepted without even blinking. Typically they don't even look at the info, they just see you wave something that looks vaguely right at them and they're…

Yea, this is a problem, too. Know why liquor stores [generally] scrutinize IDs carefully when someone who looks young tries to buy alcohol? Because there are actually legal consequences to them for getting it wrong that governments love to enforce.

Re: Fake vaccine cards are everywhere. It’s a public health nightmare

#35

Post by jaywalk »

riskable wrote: post #22

As long as there's some mechanism to identify the fraudulent cards people can be held accountable for trying to pass off a fake as the real thing. Making, selling, or using a fake vaccination card is a felony. Can just anybody call up say, Walmart and verify if a vaccination card supposedly filled out by them is authentic? If not then that's the issue. Not the fact that fakes exist.

Yes, let's just make everyone's private medical info even less private! That's the ticket!

Re: Fake vaccine cards are everywhere. It’s a public health nightmare

#36

Post by happytoexplain »

nvelty wrote: post #24

This is a direct result of the (intentionally) punitive nature of vaccine mandates. Broad, heavy-handed actions by the government are the classic spark for societal backlash. A softer approach that focused on positive benefits for having a vax pass versus punishing unvaxxed would probably had better results. Instead, we've pushed (presumably) otherwise law-abiding citizens into using forged documents. This directly u…

My observation is that the political polarization of the topic came before any government action, and is the more primary cause of the issue. Government action (both heavy-handed and otherwise) sparks backlash because of the political polarization.

Re: Fake vaccine cards are everywhere. It’s a public health nightmare

#38

Post by all2 »

happytoexplain wrote: post #21
freddealmeida wrote: post #12

I highly disagree with this. In fact, I think the best thing for the world is more fake ids. So we can search for true vectors of disease, such as MRNA gene therapies that are not fully tested. Passports are just a means to move to a social credit score. Which is horrifying in its implications.

Can't we both research vectors and have vaccine cards? And surely you're exaggerating by the use of the word "just". Maybe there is some circle I have not interacted with where a vaccine card is a weird social status thing, but they are also literally vaccine cards. Medical records conveying actionable information, in addition to whatever else, however inherently imperfect at that job.

You misinterpret "social credit score". GP means a Chinese-esque implementation of government tracking that shows whether you are a "quality citizen" or not.
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