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No Way to Grow Up

nytimes.com

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Re: No Way to Grow Up

#31

Post by Jtsummers »

amelius wrote: post #13

If kids have to save the grown ups, then they have a strong bargaining position to e.g. fix the climate ASAP. => Why don't they use it?

Because they have neither power nor authority. First, kids don't have a vote so they really have no direct influence in a democratic/representative republic system. Second, they have no money, so they have limited ability to exert financial/economic pressure.

What are they supposed to bargain with? They are (as a population, individuals may be exceptions to this) fundamentally dependent upon the adult population for their existence. Food, shelter, clothing, transportation is all (in the US) provided by adults for the vast majority of kids, at least below age 16, and still the majority for most 16/17 year olds. If we permit 18-20 year olds to still be counted as "kids", they are still poor and a very small voting bloc that is notorious for not showing up to vote, even if they are increasingly independent.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#32

Post by raunak »

stathibus wrote: post #12
oh_sigh wrote: post #7

The article mentions increased suicide rates, especially among adolescent females, as part of "The Toll", but the study linked to specifically says: "(6). Finally, this analysis was not designed to determine whether a causal link existed between these trends and the COVID-19 pandemic."

I don't think its much of a stretch. Besides, what are you going to do, ask them why they committed suicide?

Yeah, strikes me as one of those things that should be accepted without that “link” - like really, the suicide rate just went up that much, and we’re gonna assume it was _not_ related to COVID/quarantine?

Feels like it should be accepted.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#33

Post by titanomachy »

librarianscott wrote: post #22

You can't have a years-long pandemic without consequences, good and bad. My state of Texas has had schools open almost all of this time--and we're not doing better than the other states. Where are all the folks in the United States who say that parents are the best teachers of their children, that home-schooling should rule the day, that the best care comes from families? That would imply that children would be bette…

Parents aren't home-schooling... they're trying to keep working full-time while their kids sit on the computer and try to learn over zoom. There's no comparison.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#34

Post by paxys »

When I was a kid there was a big earthquake where I lived and my life was disrupted for a few weeks. Many decades later I still have latent trauma from that incident.

Children involved in situations like accidents, wars, disasters and abuse need years and sometimes lifelong therapy to deal with it. We are kidding ourselves if we think that the long list of behavioral changes we are starting to see in kids is simply attributed to keeping them at home, and when school reopens they will magically get back to normal. They have been exposed to non-stop disruption, illness, death and uncertainty for two years now.

Whether the covid pandemic goes away or not, a mental health one is upon us soon.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#35

Post by wayoutthere »

superfrank wrote: post #18

I'm not sure I like this article. They seems to overstate what the sources they link to claim. For example the article says > Some researchers are skeptical that school closures reduce Covid cases in most instances. But when you go to the study they link, it says > Although school closures reduce the number of contacts children have, and may decrease transmission, a study of 12 million adults in the UK found no diffe…

This is an attempt at manufacturing consensus by making it seem like these arguments are coming “from the adults in the room” because it’s in the NYTimes. They’re so good at gaslighting their readers (and I say this coming from the left of the NYT, not the right).

You’ll start to see liberal politicians using these same talking points in the coming weeks, guaranteed.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#37

Post by tehjoker »

I wonder how all those kids with long covid will view decisions to physically disable them potentially for life so the state could force their parents to work.

I wonder how kids mental health copes with the idea that adults will intentionally expose them and others to a deadly disease with no mitigations to make money.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#38

Post by [deleted] »

throwawayboise wrote: post #4

I am very thankful that my youngest graduated high school in 2020. The last couple of months were screwed up, but there wasn't much real education lost by then; most seniors pretty much check out after Spring Break anyway. I really feel for the kids who are younger. The effects of this are going to be with us for decades.

[deleted]

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#39

Post by xwdv »

monkeybutton wrote: post #14

So, is Covid the shock that leads to the education system being reinvented for the better or do school boards just keep bumbling along like before? Do zero-tolerance policies really work? Why are students falling behind in mathematics compared to the rest of the world? Does overloading of take home work produce better test scores, or does it just consume free time and stress out kids? Are teachers ever going to be pa…

It is obvious what will happen. The education system will crumble, inequality will grow, and to make up for having a poorly educated work force we will adopt more automation or AI-assisted tasks with very structured workflows to reduce cognitive requirements. Only elites will be able to afford giving their children strong educations and social experiences, presumably with other elite children. This will allow some children to pursue high status high skill careers while the rest must settle for whatever they can grab.

At the same time, children will increasingly grow to be emotionally underdeveloped, leading to poor romantic relationships filled with toxicity, leaving them perpetually unsatisfied with life and cynical of others. Poor quality breeding will become rampant and add to the problem.

Re: No Way to Grow Up

#40

Post by aantix »

woodruffw wrote: post #24
FiReaNG3L wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Counterpoint: at first it was extremely obvious that this virus was affecting you harder the older you are, with 60+ populations starting to be at risk. Nobody thought it was harming children.

The reasoning here is flawed: we had early positive evidence that COVID-19 was particularly dangerous for the elderly and those with a variety of medical preconditions. We didn't have positive or negative evidence that children weren't an at-risk group (for any number of reasons: lack of case evidence, the fact that children can't be modeled medically as adults, etc.). Instead, we applied the lessons of the common fl…

>We didn't have positive or negative evidence that children weren't an at-risk group

Why aren't the low death rates for the 0-17 cohort enough?

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