We need to reclaim our attention • Hacker News Board

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#31

Post by jacquesm » Sun, Jan 02, 2022, 2:56 PM UTC

criley2 wrote: post #29

wrnr wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The entire way the old media reports on the new media is unironical scaremongering about how the internet is hacking the fear response of your amygdala. They should instead be positive and publish articles like "Here are 10 youtube channels that go into more depth that the master program of any university".

Why would old media publish articles that people don't want to read? No one would read "here are 10 youtube channels that are more in depth than a master program". They would go out of business in a quarter. It's not like old media doesn't publish a variety of content and then evaluate which gets the most views already. They know we don't want to sit through fifty hours of academic lectures instead of reality tv. I a…

The scary thing about that is that if you convince enough people that violence and collapse are imminent it may well become true.

Scenes in Amsterdam right now:

https://www.nu.nl/binnenland/6176186/noodbevel-museumplein-n...

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#32

Post by ErikVandeWater » Sun, Jan 02, 2022, 2:56 PM UTC

bpodgursky wrote: post #17

ErikVandeWater wrote: post #10

The problem isn't as much that social media is addictive. The issue is that people aren't happy with their other options of what to do. If you have a draining job and don't have energy to put into a hobby, or you don't have lots of friends to hang out with, you're much more likely to waste time on something addictive.

The default human condition is to be slightly bored much of the day. This is true now, this was true in hunter-gatherer societies. These kind of traps are addictive to even otherwise happy and well-connected people; there are basically no subcultures on earth that has produced individuals who voluntarily abstain from social media (only cultures where such technology is banned entirely, like the Amish).

It's not about abstaining completely. There's nothing wrong spending some time catching up with what your friends are doing using social media. It's when you spend more time than you'd like to that it becomes a problem.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#33

Post by dominotw » Sun, Jan 02, 2022, 2:56 PM UTC

radicalbyte wrote: post #18

My attention has collapsed in recent times, but it's not because of mobiles. It's because I have three young kids. You literally have to keep your eye on them at all times so you stop them killing themselves. Also, going from 8 hrs of sleep a night + 1 hr of intensive sport a day to 4-5 hrs of sleep a night and 1 hr of sport a year is an absolute mind killer. When I was younger I could never imagine going into manage…

> 1 hr of intensive sport a day to 1 hr of sport a year

did you make this tradeoff by choice( vs religious reasons ect) . I've never been that active but you sound like someone who enjoyed sports and being active.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#34

Post by jacquesm » Sun, Jan 02, 2022, 2:57 PM UTC

le-mark wrote: post #25

jacquesm wrote: post #8

There is a veritable war going on for your attention, and the battlefields are your eyeballs, your ears and ultimately your brain. Psychologists have been enlisted, as they are in every war to try to win it for 'their side', be it one of the big silos or some dying TV or newspaper era behemoth, there is no reasonable way in which you can withstand that kind of frontal onslaught. The only way to really deal with this…

Recently my son (8) was talking about how cool his uncles vr headset is and made the leap to what if that was in your brain! I was impressed he made that connection. Then I reminded him how all the games on his iPad forced him to watch ads, wouldn’t that be a similar situation, only in his brain? His eyes got wide then he got a disgusted look on his face. He agreed that would suck. I personally think there have alway…

That kid will go places if he can reason like that at that age. Wow.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#35

Post by mc32 » Sun, Jan 02, 2022, 2:57 PM UTC

jacquesm wrote: post #8

There is a veritable war going on for your attention, and the battlefields are your eyeballs, your ears and ultimately your brain. Psychologists have been enlisted, as they are in every war to try to win it for 'their side', be it one of the big silos or some dying TV or newspaper era behemoth, there is no reasonable way in which you can withstand that kind of frontal onslaught. The only way to really deal with this…

I’d say more broadly it will be used for manipulative purposes.

It’s a great tool for getting eager participants and then “gamifying” it to achieve some wanted behavior that extends to real life.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#36

Post by jacquesm » Sun, Jan 02, 2022, 2:59 PM UTC

mc32 wrote: post #35

jacquesm wrote: post #8

There is a veritable war going on for your attention, and the battlefields are your eyeballs, your ears and ultimately your brain. Psychologists have been enlisted, as they are in every war to try to win it for 'their side', be it one of the big silos or some dying TV or newspaper era behemoth, there is no reasonable way in which you can withstand that kind of frontal onslaught. The only way to really deal with this…

I’d say more broadly it will be used for manipulative purposes. It’s a great tool for getting eager participants and then “gamifying” it to achieve some wanted behavior that extends to real life.

That is much darker, but also a distinct possibility.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#37

Post by lr4444lr » Sun, Jan 02, 2022, 3:00 PM UTC

kkjjkgjjgg wrote: post #12

lr4444lr wrote: post #3

This is a major reason why I am bearish about online learning. I do love the accessibility of MOOCs, but I have to watch the videos multiple times to deeply understand the concepts, and I have to print out the assignments in order to really play with the ideas and solve them in a way that makes me grow. I prefer whenever possible to buy books. I'm not a bibliophile; I just do MUCH better when the target of my attenti…

Have you tried sitting in a classroom? That can be very boring, too, and there is no way to rewind. Personally I also prefer books and written articles for learning, but for some reason, many people seem to prefer videos.

I do excellently in a classroom as long as the professor is teaching to the upper 25%.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#38

Post by 01acheru » Sun, Jan 02, 2022, 3:01 PM UTC

bpodgursky wrote: post #17

ErikVandeWater wrote: post #10

The problem isn't as much that social media is addictive. The issue is that people aren't happy with their other options of what to do. If you have a draining job and don't have energy to put into a hobby, or you don't have lots of friends to hang out with, you're much more likely to waste time on something addictive.

The default human condition is to be slightly bored much of the day. This is true now, this was true in hunter-gatherer societies. These kind of traps are addictive to even otherwise happy and well-connected people; there are basically no subcultures on earth that has produced individuals who voluntarily abstain from social media (only cultures where such technology is banned entirely, like the Amish).

I find your two concepts of boredom incredibly different one from the other.

When you have dopamine tablets as low hanging fruit you use them as much as you can so to keep your mind busy, in a simple society you don’t have those tablets all around 24/7.

People are praying on our boredom in our contemporary society, it wasn’t like that in the past.

Plus, I don’t think the default to be being slightly bored but being slightly mentally inactive, boredom is a modern concept of our very complex modernity.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#39

Post by batch12 » Sun, Jan 02, 2022, 3:02 PM UTC

It is weird to me that someone can watch their kid (I know that this is a godparent) go down this path and not intervene. If the cause of dropping out really was distraction, it is sad that the parent didn't take the device from the child. The kid's parents paid for this conduit monthly.

Re: We need to reclaim our attention

#40

Post by hindsightbias » Sun, Jan 02, 2022, 3:02 PM UTC

300bps wrote: post #5

I’ve said for years that the 20th century saw humanity for the first time having to learn to live in a world of infinite sugar, fat and salt. The 21st century will be about learning to live in a world of infinite information. We will all have to be mindful of whether we are consuming the mental equivalent of broccoli, donuts or anthrax.

HFCS, fat and salt