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The biggest crypto lending company is a ponzi scheme

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Re: The biggest crypto lending company is a ponzi scheme

#31

Post by anonymoushn »

prepend wrote: post #8

This seems so common to me and it’s surprising how many of these ventures are around. And that they haven’t busted yet. I looked at these a few years ago when the 5%+ returns started popping up and they are all unregulated, not fdic insured, and seem to survive on bitcoin’s ever increasing rise. If these returns were true then institutional investors would use them. But they do seem like they should have collapsed ye…

> If these returns were true then institutional investors would use them. But they do seem like they should have collapsed years ago.

After trying to raise money for arb strategies with higher returns than Celsius all year I'm really tired of hearing this.

Re: The biggest crypto lending company is a ponzi scheme

#32

Post by LunaSea »

remram wrote: post #18
exportedm wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also in a legal sense. The Celsius user agreement explicitly states that you are giving your coins to Celsius: you have no legal claim to them, you’re relying on the goodwill of Celsius to return them… meaning if Celsius goes under, your collateral is gone.

So you're selling your coins for half the USD value, but you have to return the USD at some point anyway? Why wouldn't you just sell your coins at full value instead of using this "loan"?

Because the coins might have been obtained in an illegal way.

Re: The biggest crypto lending company is a ponzi scheme

#33

Post by exdsq »

criddell wrote: post #29
WFHRenaissance wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not a huge fan of the the current cryptocurrency scene, but I think it will remain very useful as a medium of exchange and store of value in unstable parts of the globe for years to come.

It will remain a very useful medium of exchange? Are you saying that today it is a very useful medium of exchange? Are you using it that way?

It's better than trading pre-paid phone credit plans!

Re: The biggest crypto lending company is a ponzi scheme

#34

Post by xyzzy123 »

remram wrote: post #18
exportedm wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also in a legal sense. The Celsius user agreement explicitly states that you are giving your coins to Celsius: you have no legal claim to them, you’re relying on the goodwill of Celsius to return them… meaning if Celsius goes under, your collateral is gone.

So you're selling your coins for half the USD value, but you have to return the USD at some point anyway? Why wouldn't you just sell your coins at full value instead of using this "loan"?

Assume you want to HODL crypto forever (you DCA x% of your salary into it) but need to pay for a temporary expense.

You're not selling the coins, you're pawning them.

Also you wouldn't have to pay capital gains tax in countries that require that on crypto sales.

Re: The biggest crypto lending company is a ponzi scheme

#36

Post by jeremyjh »

remram wrote: post #18
exportedm wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also in a legal sense. The Celsius user agreement explicitly states that you are giving your coins to Celsius: you have no legal claim to them, you’re relying on the goodwill of Celsius to return them… meaning if Celsius goes under, your collateral is gone.

So you're selling your coins for half the USD value, but you have to return the USD at some point anyway? Why wouldn't you just sell your coins at full value instead of using this "loan"?

My guess is you want to HODL and let your "assets" appreciate in value, but need liquidity. I can't really imagine why you'd trust any company in the crypto space with long-term storage of your assets.

Re: The biggest crypto lending company is a ponzi scheme

#37

Post by UnpossibleJim »

gentleman11 wrote: post #10

We keep expecting crypto to die but then again, we still have antivirus software that is spyware (avast), a scammy vpn industry, and a thriving anti vax movement. No matter how absurd it is, it might stick around for a long time now

I look at it like the lottery or casinos. I'm not a gambler exceptthe occasionalpoker game with friends, and I abhor casinos, but they make billions(?) Of dollars. Everyone has got Crypto figured out! They've read all the reports, and keep up with the graphs and this time! This time!

The funny thing is, I clicked on a few articles about NFT's and the metaverse because I was interested in the programming behind it and now my morning feed is filled with articles about "How to invest in crypto!", "We can tell you how to beat th crypto market!", "Check out these super looking graphs of crypto prices!".

Re: The biggest crypto lending company is a ponzi scheme

#38

Post by ebiester »

obayesshelton wrote: post #15

Crypto and NFT is one big ponzi scheme. Who on earth is spending $000,000s on a virtual ship? I sense it is a case of somebody close to the NFT or virtual world buying the asset and making out it is a great thing and then selling it on quickly. Many a scam involves somebody from the group buying something so the unwilling feel like it safe. As always, don't be left holding the baby.

Art is a really weird market in general. The problem with NFT is that people are buying it as an investment rather than a work of art with its own merit of which appreciation might be one benefit.

There's likely no museum backstop for most NFTs. (By which I mean that rich people buy art, sell it amongst themselves/have inflated art appraisals to raise the price, and donate to museums and claim as a tax writeoff.) See https://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-irs2mar02-story.html

NFT as a concept will live - I can see them as placed alongside offline art as an online component that doubles as proof of ownership and lineage, and in the long run could be a major anti-counterfitting strategy.

Re: The biggest crypto lending company is a ponzi scheme

#39

Post by agleason »

criddell wrote: post #29
WFHRenaissance wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not a huge fan of the the current cryptocurrency scene, but I think it will remain very useful as a medium of exchange and store of value in unstable parts of the globe for years to come.

It will remain a very useful medium of exchange? Are you saying that today it is a very useful medium of exchange? Are you using it that way?

If I need to move money between countries, it certainly is by far the easiest. Traveling in India trying to get my friend money has been an awful headache. With cryptocurrency, it's quite simple

Re: The biggest crypto lending company is a ponzi scheme

#40

Post by astoor »

avrionov wrote: post #17
gentleman11 wrote: post #10

We keep expecting crypto to die but then again, we still have antivirus software that is spyware (avast), a scammy vpn industry, and a thriving anti vax movement. No matter how absurd it is, it might stick around for a long time now

This all true, but avast and the vpn industry are 2 orders of magnitude smaller than the crypto.

And anti-virus and VPN industry problems don't pose a systemic risk to the Western economy (I say Western because China etc. have cracked down on cryptocurrency schemes).
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