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Rich Harris joins Vercel to work on Svelte full time

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Re: Rich Harris joins Vercel to work on Svelte full time

#31
post #23

Well, this is awesome -- but fuck me: Vue is the only major player not under the Vercel umbrella now, haha. Looks like I might have to phone in half a decade of experience. Svelte is close enough to Vue with "script setup" mode anyways, the major difference is whether your logic/keywords go INSIDE the HTML tags or OUTSIDE. Svelte doesn't support JSX/TSX though =(

> Svelte doesn't support JSX/TSX though =( You have https://www.solidjs.com/ that does

Solid is really cool, and I love the posts by it's author describing the journey to performance that is some years old now.

But what is unique about Vue is that it lets you arbitrarily mix ".vue" and ".jsx/.tsx" files in the same project.

So if you need to define say 50 really tiny helper components, like "Button", "Modal", etc. it's great.

I can write one TSX file and do:

   // UtilComponents.tsx
   export function Button() {}
   export function Modal() {}
   export function Icon() {}
And then in my .vue file I can do:

   
   import { Button, Modal, Icon } from "./UtilComponents"
   // ...
   
This is not a popular approach, almost nobody uses Vue's JSX/TSX and I'm not sure if people even know you can mix and match arbitrarily like this.

But I've been doing this for a long time and it works great for me haha.

Re: Rich Harris joins Vercel to work on Svelte full time

#32

Is this a bet against React or a bet for ecosystem variety and choice? I feel it's the latter right now.

If you are building a platform for web dev, it’s better to be able to control your technology. Any change FB makes to React may leave you scrambling to patch your tech. Or What if one day FB decides to stop supporting React, or they make a design decision incompatible with your business? While it sounds unlikely, it’s bitter pill to swallow from a business angle.

Re: Rich Harris joins Vercel to work on Svelte full time

#33

Well, this is awesome -- but fuck me: Vue is the only major player not under the Vercel umbrella now, haha. Looks like I might have to phone in half a decade of experience. Svelte is close enough to Vue with "script setup" mode anyways, the major difference is whether your logic/keywords go INSIDE the HTML tags or OUTSIDE. Svelte doesn't support JSX/TSX though =(

Check out what I'm working on. I'm staying indie indefinitely: https://github.com/cheatcode/joystick.

No JSX or other templating languages, just plain HTML.

Re: Rich Harris joins Vercel to work on Svelte full time

#34
post #9

It'd be more fun if I could do it in something that wasn't in Javascript or one of its Frankenstein cousins.

You can! Elm is interesting, though it's developer is a bit polarizing Also there are a host of nascent Rust/WASM frameworks starting to pop up. They really like the tree puns. There is Yew, Sycamore and Seed.

Don't forget Clojurescript.

Re: Rich Harris joins Vercel to work on Svelte full time

#35

Is this a bet against React or a bet for ecosystem variety and choice? I feel it's the latter right now.

Seems more like variety. React is in a league of it's own with React Native. For web tech Svelte is cool, for app tech it's not on the radar. I used to be a web developer, now I'm a React Native / RNW developer. I don't use web tech unless I'm making a simple web page, when I do I use vanilla HTML/CSS/optional JS. You get a web app for free when you make a RN app. You can share 95% of code among 5 platforms. (web, wi…

How is RN? I have seen several teams try to consolidate their App Devs into RN devs, only to split back into iOS/Android devs. From what I’m told, if your app could be a webpage, RN is great. But if you need to really leverage the specific platforms, it’s hard to do that.

Re: Rich Harris joins Vercel to work on Svelte full time

#36

Well, this is awesome -- but fuck me: Vue is the only major player not under the Vercel umbrella now, haha. Looks like I might have to phone in half a decade of experience. Svelte is close enough to Vue with "script setup" mode anyways, the major difference is whether your logic/keywords go INSIDE the HTML tags or OUTSIDE. Svelte doesn't support JSX/TSX though =(

I love Vue because I come from a bygone era of HTML + sprinkling jQuery as needed. 99% of the websites don't need a full blown JS frontend but everyone is doing it, I must be wrong.

You can "sprinkle" react too

Re: Rich Harris joins Vercel to work on Svelte full time

#37

It'd be more fun if I could do it in something that wasn't in Javascript or one of its Frankenstein cousins.

Is there any reason why something like Svelte couldn't be written in one of the lisply languages? The compiler approach seems definitely like a good fit.

Re: Rich Harris joins Vercel to work on Svelte full time

#38
post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I love Vue because I come from a bygone era of HTML + sprinkling jQuery as needed. 99% of the websites don't need a full blown JS frontend but everyone is doing it, I must be wrong.

Do you work with a designer? I’m convinced most of the push for JS apps as pages is mostly perpetuated by designers who don’t know how the DOM works and feel the need to redesign the wheel on every project. I work within a company that provides a design system and a platform of hundreds of generic component, but individual designers still always want to push their particular vision. I think if most designers took exi…

No, we don't have a design team, we're too small for that.

Just that our backend is already built using Django many many years ago. If I need to add some interactivity, I use jQuery currently. Looked into Vue and it allows us to keep everything as is in the backend and use it like jQuery.

I shudder everytime I need to install npm, webpack, gulp, etc..all the JS tools feel super flaky, unnecessary and does not inspire confidence in the tooling. That's my take anyways.

Lot of developers don't have the priviledge of starting a new project. It's an existing doctors appointment website or some shit people cobbled up in PHP in 2004 that is still running and we need to maintain it.

Re: Rich Harris joins Vercel to work on Svelte full time

#39
Cloudflare will regret not having a developer go-to framework for their advanced Worker stuff one day.

I think they are waiting for someone else to build for it which is IMO the completely wrong approach for the dream of the serverless app. You got to own the full stack including software.

I can easily see Vercel becoming the pretty much only go-to in this space just from the developer trust they have created with Next (and now Svelte). The general getting started experience between the two serverless providers is night and day.

One is where do I begin / how should I do this (cloudflare).

The other is simply code... and... go! (vercel)

I'll be all in on whatever Rich makes there. Been waiting for a solid Cloudflare Worker framework for literally years bridging front-end and back-end. Instead, we got Pages (which is cool, just boring for the fun stuff).

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