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Notes from the Meeting on Python GIL Removal Between Python Core and Sam Gross

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31–40 of 105 posts

Re: Notes from the Meeting on Python GIL Removal Between Python Core and Sam Gross

#31
post #18

Why is it never mentioned that Sam the lone genius Gross who is "interested in PyTorch training workflows" is a fulltime Facebook employee? Not that it's bad but it should be mentioned that it's a corporate initiative.

There's funding and then there's research. I'd share headline credit about initiative to the person as well.

Re: Notes from the Meeting on Python GIL Removal Between Python Core and Sam Gross

#32
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unladen Swallow is a 20% project. Besides, LLVM's JIT turns out to be an disappointment and I believe that no modern interpreted language uses LLVM's JIT at this moment.

Doesn’t Julia?

Julia is not interpreted.

Re: Notes from the Meeting on Python GIL Removal Between Python Core and Sam Gross

#33
post #18

Why is it never mentioned that Sam the lone genius Gross who is "interested in PyTorch training workflows" is a fulltime Facebook employee? Not that it's bad but it should be mentioned that it's a corporate initiative.

Is it actually a corporate initiative? The project is hosted on Sam's personal GitHub[1].

[1]: https://github.com/colesbury/nogil

Re: Notes from the Meeting on Python GIL Removal Between Python Core and Sam Gross

#34
post #18

Why is it never mentioned that Sam the lone genius Gross who is "interested in PyTorch training workflows" is a fulltime Facebook employee? Not that it's bad but it should be mentioned that it's a corporate initiative.

Why is that relevant? Many of the people contributing significantly to CPython also have full time jobs elsewhere. Sometimes their full time job overlaps with their contributions and sometimes it does not. For example Guido works for Microsoft and is working on CPython performance there, does that mean all of his work needs an asterisk saying it's actually a Microsoft corporate initiative?

Re: Notes from the Meeting on Python GIL Removal Between Python Core and Sam Gross

#35
post #22

I think Python core developers should not worry about closed-source enterprise Python code. If users are gaining performance, they will bend over backward porting their code to this new version. At minimum, I predict, all FAANGMULA would jumped in the bandwagon and create a pretty big ripple effect.

100% agree, it is also impossible to quantify so can never really be a useful factor in decision making.

And Python is not a business with customers. It’s an open source volunteer project.

Re: Notes from the Meeting on Python GIL Removal Between Python Core and Sam Gross

#36
post #2

I can't help but read all the interjections from the core developers as a strong indication of why all these sorts of things tend to fail on the vine. From Unladen Swallow onward there have been these groups off doing interesting and awesome experiments to try and make Python faster, and they never actually make it into something that Python end-users can use (yes, I know US had shortcomings). This is the work of one…

> Would you prefer to support some weird arbitrary nameless closed source extensions, or have a multicore Python? There's nothing wrong with staying on an older LTS version of Python. Let the people with the nameless closed-source stuff stick with that. The beauty of open source is that they can fork the older, GIL-ful version of Python and maintain it, if they like. Multicore would be a tremendous boon to the langua…

> an older LTS version of Python

There was an older LTS version of Python called Python 2.7. Last I checked people hated the transition and were still bitching about it in 2021.

Re: Notes from the Meeting on Python GIL Removal Between Python Core and Sam Gross

#37
post #22

I think Python core developers should not worry about closed-source enterprise Python code. If users are gaining performance, they will bend over backward porting their code to this new version. At minimum, I predict, all FAANGMULA would jumped in the bandwagon and create a pretty big ripple effect.

I have heard of FAANG. I guess M stands for Microsoft. Who's ULA?

Re: Notes from the Meeting on Python GIL Removal Between Python Core and Sam Gross

#38
post #18

Why is it never mentioned that Sam the lone genius Gross who is "interested in PyTorch training workflows" is a fulltime Facebook employee? Not that it's bad but it should be mentioned that it's a corporate initiative.

Is it actually a corporate initiative? The project is hosted on Sam's personal GitHub[1]. [1]: https://github.com/colesbury/nogil

It may not be a Facebook initiative in the corporate strategy sense, but it's definitely a Facebook project, done on Facebook's dime. From the horse's mouth: https://lwn.net/ml/python-dev/CAGr09bRSwfinXNe4acTrpR8bM7nYh...

Re: Notes from the Meeting on Python GIL Removal Between Python Core and Sam Gross

#39
post #18

Why is it never mentioned that Sam the lone genius Gross who is "interested in PyTorch training workflows" is a fulltime Facebook employee? Not that it's bad but it should be mentioned that it's a corporate initiative.

PyTorch seems to obfuscate its Facebook ownership in general. At least I could find no mention of it on their "About" page or in the documentation, where the only mention of "Facebook" is a link in the footer to the PyTorch project's own social media page: https://pytorch.org/features/

At least the "Brand Guidelines" PDF makes it clear that “PyTorch, the PyTorch logo and any related marks are trademarks of Facebook, Inc.”: https://pytorch.org/assets/brand-guidelines/PyTorch-Brand-Gu...

Also a small hint in `CONTRIBUTING.md`: https://github.com/pytorch/pytorch/blob/master/CONTRIBUTING....

Re: Notes from the Meeting on Python GIL Removal Between Python Core and Sam Gross

#40
post #37
post #22

I think Python core developers should not worry about closed-source enterprise Python code. If users are gaining performance, they will bend over backward porting their code to this new version. At minimum, I predict, all FAANGMULA would jumped in the bandwagon and create a pretty big ripple effect.

I have heard of FAANG. I guess M stands for Microsoft. Who's ULA?

Uber Lyft Airbnb most likely (this generally is shorthand for public unicorns and similar well respected major companies that contribute to open source).
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