Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Microsoft removes hot reload from open source .NET, locks it to Visual Studio

github.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

31–40 of 62 posts

Re: Microsoft removes hot reload from open source .NET, locks it to Visual Studio

#31

Post by tluyben2 »

atraac wrote: post #22
MauroIksem wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Visual studio is anything but legacy and I haven't found anything better. Where does the future lie?

IMO - Rider. It's way better with its autocomplete, refactoring, renames, code completion, debugging, 3rd party code navigation, overall responsiveness. I've switched and I feel physically disabled whenever I have to do something in Visual Studio again. The only thing that is lacking in Rider is Azure support(plugin is meh), but I don't really use that anymore, we have CI/CD for that.

I try Rider ever so often but what specs are your system; it is basically unusable after I load one of our bigger projects... My m1 16gb just grinds to halt and before I had a beefy thinkpad with 32gb and that stalled completely too. While VS has no issue at all.

Re: Microsoft removes hot reload from open source .NET, locks it to Visual Studio

#32

Post by tluyben2 »

deburo wrote: post #15
ripley12 wrote: post #6

I'm the author of that issue. I think I can be a little more frank here: this is a horrifically short-sighted decision that has me scared for the future of .NET. I have a tremendous amount of respect for the .NET team, and I'm very certain they're not the ones behind this. I've been incredibly impressed by the hot reload solution that the .NET team has delivered. It's worked remarkably well in preview across multiple…

I understand the huge disappointment but there’s a bit of hyperbole there. Anyway, lets hope they reconsider w/ .net 7. At the pace they’re going, in a years time.

As someone who has put the future of my company on .net core this is not hyperbole; this is quite a worrying development. I did not pick Java because .net core has served me well when I build some prototypes 5 years ago (the 15 years before that we did mostly but I sold that company and all my colleagues were tied in the sale, willingly so I could re evaluate tech).

Re: Microsoft removes hot reload from open source .NET, locks it to Visual Studio

#33

Post by atraac »

tluyben2 wrote: post #31
atraac wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO - Rider. It's way better with its autocomplete, refactoring, renames, code completion, debugging, 3rd party code navigation, overall responsiveness. I've switched and I feel physically disabled whenever I have to do something in Visual Studio again. The only thing that is lacking in Rider is Azure support(plugin is meh), but I don't really use that anymore, we have CI/CD for that.

I try Rider ever so often but what specs are your system; it is basically unusable after I load one of our bigger projects... My m1 16gb just grinds to halt and before I had a beefy thinkpad with 32gb and that stalled completely too. While VS has no issue at all.

I have a 16gb Surface Book 2 at work and a personal high specced Dell XPS 9570, both are perfectly fine, even with quite big solutions. Rider has fairly long startup because it's indexing _everything_(this is why code completion is so good) but other than that it is perfectly fluid to work with. With VS(2019) Roslynator worked fine but solution would also take a lot of time to load. I have more issues with Teams than any IDE to be honest.

Re: Microsoft removes hot reload from open source .NET, locks it to Visual Studio

#34

Post by blub »

ripley12 wrote: post #6

I'm the author of that issue. I think I can be a little more frank here: this is a horrifically short-sighted decision that has me scared for the future of .NET. I have a tremendous amount of respect for the .NET team, and I'm very certain they're not the ones behind this. I've been incredibly impressed by the hot reload solution that the .NET team has delivered. It's worked remarkably well in preview across multiple…

There's a lesson that you may not want to learn here: the guaranteed disappointment in .NET and Microsoft can be reasonably easily avoided by avoiding them.

Re: Microsoft removes hot reload from open source .NET, locks it to Visual Studio

#35

Post by tluyben2 »

lostmsu wrote: post #19
devwastaken wrote: post #18

.NET is one of those languages you want to give a chance, and every time you do, it does something incredibly short sighted and harmful to itself. You just can't change Microsoft. You can put fancy new skins on things and say you're part of the cool kids, but remember the people who made all of Microsoft s terrible moments aren't the young devs that care. It's management. The only way I will ever use .net is if an ac…

There's already Mono.

Mono is quite worthless server-side compared to .net core 5.

Re: Microsoft removes hot reload from open source .NET, locks it to Visual Studio

#36

Post by tluyben2 »

fartcannon wrote: post #9

At some point you have to start asking yourself, why do I tolerate this stuff when there are better alternatives elsewhere? Ditch Microsoft. Ditch closed computing.

Better is in the eye of the beholder; in my business you can choose .net or Jvm. And then c# or Java, not f# or clojure.

Re: Microsoft removes hot reload from open source .NET, locks it to Visual Studio

#37

Post by tluyben2 »

blub wrote: post #34
ripley12 wrote: post #6

I'm the author of that issue. I think I can be a little more frank here: this is a horrifically short-sighted decision that has me scared for the future of .NET. I have a tremendous amount of respect for the .NET team, and I'm very certain they're not the ones behind this. I've been incredibly impressed by the hot reload solution that the .NET team has delivered. It's worked remarkably well in preview across multiple…

There's a lesson that you may not want to learn here: the guaranteed disappointment in .NET and Microsoft can be reasonably easily avoided by avoiding them .

As someone who suffered through MS and Oracle (Oracle directly killed one of my companies; MS did a lot of collateral damage) in the 80s and 90s, they have been more than nice for the open source community after Balmer. I hope they rectify this one.

Re: Microsoft removes hot reload from open source .NET, locks it to Visual Studio

#38

Post by WalterGR »

sterlind wrote: post #21
WalterGR wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s their own code. You’re accusing Microsoft of EEEing their own code?

EEE isn't about the code, it's about the community. They brought in a lot of people from the Linux world through .Net Core, proper Linux support and porting tons of libraries. They could next try to convert those to paying customers by locking them into VS. I work at MS, and I love .Net, but I'm really frustrated at this. I have a disability and VS Code is far more accessible for me (b/c extensions), but it's painful…

I think - though I can’t recall any on the spot- that there are “Open Source Companies” - that give away the main thing, but charge for advanced features. Any idea if this is the case?

Re: Microsoft removes hot reload from open source .NET, locks it to Visual Studio

#39

Post by [deleted] »

atraac wrote: post #22
MauroIksem wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Visual studio is anything but legacy and I haven't found anything better. Where does the future lie?

IMO - Rider. It's way better with its autocomplete, refactoring, renames, code completion, debugging, 3rd party code navigation, overall responsiveness. I've switched and I feel physically disabled whenever I have to do something in Visual Studio again. The only thing that is lacking in Rider is Azure support(plugin is meh), but I don't really use that anymore, we have CI/CD for that.

[deleted]

Re: Microsoft removes hot reload from open source .NET, locks it to Visual Studio

#40

Post by moogly »

tluyben2 wrote: post #31
atraac wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IMO - Rider. It's way better with its autocomplete, refactoring, renames, code completion, debugging, 3rd party code navigation, overall responsiveness. I've switched and I feel physically disabled whenever I have to do something in Visual Studio again. The only thing that is lacking in Rider is Azure support(plugin is meh), but I don't really use that anymore, we have CI/CD for that.

I try Rider ever so often but what specs are your system; it is basically unusable after I load one of our bigger projects... My m1 16gb just grinds to halt and before I had a beefy thinkpad with 32gb and that stalled completely too. While VS has no issue at all.

I've heard JetBrains' IDEs have had performance problems on macOS forever from Mac users (is it because of the Java?). They work great on Windows and Linux in my experience.
Post reply on HN