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Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri)

releases.ubuntu.com

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Re: Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri)

#31

Post by jgb1984 »

CarelessExpert wrote: post #29
jgb1984 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a 20+ years Debian user I've never seen the added value of Ubuntu. Why use a derivative if you can get the real thing?

First and foremost, package recency. If you run stable, which is released as snapshots ala Ubuntu, the packages are ancient. If you run testing, which is a rolling distro ala Arch, they're a lot newer and pretty solid, but security updates lag. If you run unstable, which is also rolling, things can (rarely) break. Additionally, Ubuntu has decided to incorporate non-free software and drivers right into the base produc…

Exactly, Debian has you covered depending on your needs. I run Debian Stable on servers and Debian Sid on my desktop and laptop. Had 2 or 3 non-booting Sid systems over the course of 20 years, none or which weren't solved in 10 minutes after asking for help on IRC.

I doubt Ubuntu offers newer packages than my Debian Sid installation.

As for drivers and firmware etc as I've mentioned below I've installed a new state of the art desktop in recent weeks and everything simply worked. From the wifi to Bluetooth to the Nvidia gpu. I wouldn't call enabling the non-free repo "work" since it's just a question to answer during the installation...

Re: Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri)

#32

Post by BiteCode_dev »

I've been fighting to keep Unity as long as I could, but it's now breaking too often so I accepted my gnome shell fate. It requires 10 plugins, one app, and manually crafted .desktop files to be usable, but ok, it's free software, I'll adapt.

I understand the rational to also push for wayland first now, but it breaks my workflow for things like autokey. We do need to move from X11, but once again, something I will have to work with.

And now Firefox is a snap, which is slow, has permissions problems all around (guaranteed the sandbox will break some addons), takes a lot of space, etc. Again, I get it, it's a perfect candidate to push the tech, and they need to solve user facing apps distribution problem with linux.

I like Ubuntu a lot. I donate to it. I don't want to migrate to Manjaro or something else. Ubuntu is the sweet spot for things working out of the box.

But with 21.010, I really feel like at least moving to Elementary or PopOS right now. Tried them, the first one can't install (EFI partition is too small), the second breaks on my machine.

I don't like KDE, so I guess, next is Xubuntu? Something else?

Re: Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri)

#33

Post by larntz »

BiteCode_dev wrote: post #27
jgb1984 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a 20+ years Debian user I've never seen the added value of Ubuntu. Why use a derivative if you can get the real thing?

It works out of the box for most hardware, install proprietary things easily, including drivers and codecs, and have more up to date softwares. It also have lots of usability tweaks. You can, have all that with debian, but then you have to do the work. I don't want to do the work if canonical can do it for me.

Have you considered Fedora?

I recently moved from Arch to Fedora and I have all the same up to date vanilla packages without having to do any real work.

Re: Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri)

#34

Post by jgb1984 »

BiteCode_dev wrote: post #27
jgb1984 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a 20+ years Debian user I've never seen the added value of Ubuntu. Why use a derivative if you can get the real thing?

It works out of the box for most hardware, install proprietary things easily, including drivers and codecs, and have more up to date softwares. It also have lots of usability tweaks. You can, have all that with debian, but then you have to do the work. I don't want to do the work if canonical can do it for me.

I installed debian just a few weeks ago on my brand new desktop. AMD Ryzen 5800x, MSI B550 motherboard, MSI Nvidia RTX 3060 Ti. Everything worked, out of the box, without adding anything magical. Including Ethernet, wifi, Bluetooth and hardware accelerated graphics. Have been buying Nvidia gpu's since forever and their (proprietary) drivers have never let me down.

So I'm not sure what you're talking about. Also, more up to date software, I'm quite certain my Debian Sid has more recent versions of everything compared to what Ubuntu has.

Re: Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri)

#35

Post by BiteCode_dev »

larntz wrote: post #33
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It works out of the box for most hardware, install proprietary things easily, including drivers and codecs, and have more up to date softwares. It also have lots of usability tweaks. You can, have all that with debian, but then you have to do the work. I don't want to do the work if canonical can do it for me.

Have you considered Fedora? I recently moved from Arch to Fedora and I have all the same up to date vanilla packages without having to do any real work.

I tried so many distros. None of them fit the bill for a pro laptop.

I don't want to move out of ubuntu based distros, they get too many things right.

I'd rather try Elementary, Pop OS, Xubuntu, etc.

Re: Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri)

#36

Post by BiteCode_dev »

jgb1984 wrote: post #34
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It works out of the box for most hardware, install proprietary things easily, including drivers and codecs, and have more up to date softwares. It also have lots of usability tweaks. You can, have all that with debian, but then you have to do the work. I don't want to do the work if canonical can do it for me.

I installed debian just a few weeks ago on my brand new desktop. AMD Ryzen 5800x, MSI B550 motherboard, MSI Nvidia RTX 3060 Ti. Everything worked, out of the box, without adding anything magical. Including Ethernet, wifi, Bluetooth and hardware accelerated graphics. Have been buying Nvidia gpu's since forever and their (proprietary) drivers have never let me down. So I'm not sure what you're talking about. Also, more…

Yeah, I've met those kind of comments for 15 years.

There is always somebody to say that in those kind of threads. Same as Vi is easy, try Manjaro, Nix, this latest implementation of LISP, that NoSQL db, this DSL, etc.

I used to give them the benefit of the doubt, spend some time testing the alternative the person talked about, came out disappointed, and wasted time.

Now I just trust numbers. When 100 people like you will tell me the same for 3 years, I will try.

Before that, I'll stay on what I know works.

Re: Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri)

#37

Post by nsonha »

BiteCode_dev wrote: post #32

I've been fighting to keep Unity as long as I could, but it's now breaking too often so I accepted my gnome shell fate. It requires 10 plugins, one app, and manually crafted .desktop files to be usable, but ok, it's free software, I'll adapt. I understand the rational to also push for wayland first now, but it breaks my workflow for things like autokey. We do need to move from X11, but once again, something I will ha…

Isn't pop also gnome? You can install pop shell which is an extension. It adds tiling, which isn't for everyone.

I'm like you don't like the fact that defaul gnome is so bad that I need a bunch of extensions. But I don't like KDE either, looks so inconsistent, too much pointless blurring and animation. However, I guess other choices are worse because they would have some other flaws that you can't even find extensions to work around.

Re: Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri)

#38

Post by BiteCode_dev »

nsonha wrote: post #37
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #32

I've been fighting to keep Unity as long as I could, but it's now breaking too often so I accepted my gnome shell fate. It requires 10 plugins, one app, and manually crafted .desktop files to be usable, but ok, it's free software, I'll adapt. I understand the rational to also push for wayland first now, but it breaks my workflow for things like autokey. We do need to move from X11, but once again, something I will ha…

Isn't pop also gnome? You can install pop shell which is an extension. It adds tiling, which isn't for everyone. I'm like you don't like the fact that defaul gnome is so bad that I need a bunch of extensions. But I don't like KDE either, looks so inconsistent, too much pointless blurring and animation. However, I guess other choices are worse because they would have some other flaws that you can't even find extension…

I tried to install the pop shell, but it worked out badly. Those distro are not made to just have the DE installed after the installation of Ubuntu. Something always breaks.

You have to install from the official .iso

Re: Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri)

#39

Post by nsonha »

BiteCode_dev wrote: post #38
nsonha wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't pop also gnome? You can install pop shell which is an extension. It adds tiling, which isn't for everyone. I'm like you don't like the fact that defaul gnome is so bad that I need a bunch of extensions. But I don't like KDE either, looks so inconsistent, too much pointless blurring and animation. However, I guess other choices are worse because they would have some other flaws that you can't even find extension…

I tried to install the pop shell, but it worked out badly. Those distro are not made to just have the DE installed after the installation of Ubuntu. Something always breaks. You have to install from the official .iso

But it's not a DE just extension of Gnome? I've never actually tried Pop OS but after installing pop shell, I only got windows tiling. The only thing missing is the command palette which I don't really mind.

Re: Ubuntu 21.10 (Impish Indri)

#40

Post by BiteCode_dev »

nsonha wrote: post #39
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried to install the pop shell, but it worked out badly. Those distro are not made to just have the DE installed after the installation of Ubuntu. Something always breaks. You have to install from the official .iso

But it's not a DE just extension of Gnome? I've never actually tried Pop OS but after installing pop shell, I only got windows tiling. The only thing missing is the command palette which I don't really mind.

All those distros have different default settings.

E.G: full disk encryption is enabled by default when you install it, which is the opposite of most Ubuntu based distros.

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