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Cryptocurrency mining using integrated photonics

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Re: Cryptocurrency mining using integrated photonics

#31

Post by mistrial9 »

jlokier wrote: post #24

Heh. I worked on a type of photonic PoW in 2019 (but it wasn't silicon photonics). - It's faster and lower power for the hash rate. It's worth it. But not as fast and low power as hoped. - It's a great advantage for the early adopter who can mine that bit faster than everyone else for a short time. That was the motivation for the project. - Contrary to the title of the article, making hashing faster for less energy d…

> proof-of-work energy consumption is independent of the technology widely used

citation

Re: Cryptocurrency mining using integrated photonics

#32

Post by wyager »

kybernetikos wrote: post #14

Public blockchain systems are distributed databases that anyone can submit write transactions to and where you don't need preauthorisation to join the system. In order to avoid the network being taken over by sybil attacks, it's necessary for participation to be based on locking up / committing / consuming something rare. Anything that becomes cheap or easy is not suitable for basing participation on. So far I know o…

> ownership of cryptocurrency (PoS)

The problem is that PoS commitment isn’t binding. You can always stake your money, then if you don’t like the outcome, you can just pretend the first stake never happened and do it again. Cf “grinding” attack. PoW is unique in that any claimed commitment corresponds to a real, physical, irrevertable commitment.

> or storage space as that rare resource.

Every storage coin so far has been some sort of DINO scam. The most interesting one is Chia but it’s absurdly complicated, and I think that complication might mask some centralization/vulnerability. For example, the reliance on “time lord” nodes strikes me as very questionable.

Re: Cryptocurrency mining using integrated photonics

#33

Post by mistrial9 »

HNews people - multiple, lengthy comments here claim that "due to competitive pressures" the "total energy used to mine will be the same" no matter how hashes are calculated.

The challenge problem in BTC is to find a number below a threshhold that fits a pattern. The threshhold changes in a two week regime. Finding the number is not prescribed, only the threshhold. Where is the required energy use here?

Please illuminate

Re: Cryptocurrency mining using integrated photonics

#34

Post by pavlov »

mistrial9 wrote: post #33

HNews people - multiple, lengthy comments here claim that "due to competitive pressures" the "total energy used to mine will be the same" no matter how hashes are calculated. The challenge problem in BTC is to find a number below a threshhold that fits a pattern. The threshhold changes in a two week regime. Finding the number is not prescribed, only the threshhold. Where is the required energy use here? Please illumi…

If an invention enables hashes to be computed 10x more effectively, miners aren’t going to reduce their energy use by 90% — they’ll switch to the new equipment, increase their hash rate 10x, and keep using the available energy.

Re: Cryptocurrency mining using integrated photonics

#35

Post by tromp »

mistrial9 wrote: post #33

HNews people - multiple, lengthy comments here claim that "due to competitive pressures" the "total energy used to mine will be the same" no matter how hashes are calculated. The challenge problem in BTC is to find a number below a threshhold that fits a pattern. The threshhold changes in a two week regime. Finding the number is not prescribed, only the threshhold. Where is the required energy use here? Please illumi…

The difficulty D defines the expected number of double SHA256 hashes E[H] = 2^32 * D that must be computed on average per block to meet the difficulty target, which according to the average efficiency of mining ASICs implies an average amount of energy to be used.

Re: Cryptocurrency mining using integrated photonics

#36

Post by lt »

wyager wrote: post #32
kybernetikos wrote: post #14

Public blockchain systems are distributed databases that anyone can submit write transactions to and where you don't need preauthorisation to join the system. In order to avoid the network being taken over by sybil attacks, it's necessary for participation to be based on locking up / committing / consuming something rare. Anything that becomes cheap or easy is not suitable for basing participation on. So far I know o…

> ownership of cryptocurrency (PoS) The problem is that PoS commitment isn’t binding. You can always stake your money, then if you don’t like the outcome, you can just pretend the first stake never happened and do it again. Cf “grinding” attack. PoW is unique in that any claimed commitment corresponds to a real, physical, irrevertable commitment. > or storage space as that rare resource. Every storage coin so far has…

What's a DINO scam? Couldn't google anything relevant.

Re: Cryptocurrency mining using integrated photonics

#37

Post by mistrial9 »

tromp wrote: post #35
mistrial9 wrote: post #33

HNews people - multiple, lengthy comments here claim that "due to competitive pressures" the "total energy used to mine will be the same" no matter how hashes are calculated. The challenge problem in BTC is to find a number below a threshhold that fits a pattern. The threshhold changes in a two week regime. Finding the number is not prescribed, only the threshhold. Where is the required energy use here? Please illumi…

The difficulty D defines the expected number of double SHA256 hashes E[H] = 2^32 * D that must be computed on average per block to meet the difficulty target, which according to the average efficiency of mining ASICs implies an average amount of energy to be used.

first of all, difficulty D is a float, and there are no floats in the actual computation. Second, a float is not a number of hashes. bzzzzt

edit- In plain English, this explanation is incorrect because it relies on floating point number D. Difficulty D is a convenience representation as float of the ratio of two very large integers; one of those large integers is the fixed MAX Target. The other vary large integer is varied by a prescribed formula, once every two weeks.

Re: Cryptocurrency mining using integrated photonics

#38

Post by 3np »

pavlov wrote: post #34
mistrial9 wrote: post #33

HNews people - multiple, lengthy comments here claim that "due to competitive pressures" the "total energy used to mine will be the same" no matter how hashes are calculated. The challenge problem in BTC is to find a number below a threshhold that fits a pattern. The threshhold changes in a two week regime. Finding the number is not prescribed, only the threshhold. Where is the required energy use here? Please illumi…

If an invention enables hashes to be computed 10x more effectively, miners aren’t going to reduce their energy use by 90% — they’ll switch to the new equipment, increase their hash rate 10x, and keep using the available energy.

And, if they don’t, this creates an opportunity for others to outcompete them (on average) by doing just that

Re: Cryptocurrency mining using integrated photonics

#39

Post by mistrial9 »

pavlov wrote: post #34
mistrial9 wrote: post #33

HNews people - multiple, lengthy comments here claim that "due to competitive pressures" the "total energy used to mine will be the same" no matter how hashes are calculated. The challenge problem in BTC is to find a number below a threshhold that fits a pattern. The threshhold changes in a two week regime. Finding the number is not prescribed, only the threshhold. Where is the required energy use here? Please illumi…

If an invention enables hashes to be computed 10x more effectively, miners aren’t going to reduce their energy use by 90% — they’ll switch to the new equipment, increase their hash rate 10x, and keep using the available energy.

yes, agree it is roughly true that miners will very likely maximize their efforts.. this is not the question however

Re: Cryptocurrency mining using integrated photonics

#40

Post by colechristensen »

mistrial9 wrote: post #33

HNews people - multiple, lengthy comments here claim that "due to competitive pressures" the "total energy used to mine will be the same" no matter how hashes are calculated. The challenge problem in BTC is to find a number below a threshhold that fits a pattern. The threshhold changes in a two week regime. Finding the number is not prescribed, only the threshhold. Where is the required energy use here? Please illumi…

The amount of mining being done would be driven by the price of mining (fixed + recurring) and the reward for mining.

If you make mining cheaper you just get more mining, lowering energy usage per unit mining will increase the mining done to balance the reward.

Actually lowering total energy usage would require lowering total reward or raising the price of energy.

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