Ask HN: Why does Zoom Desktop examine all processes and arguments? • Hacker News Board

Re: Ask HN: Why does Zoom Desktop examine all processes and arguments?

#31

Post by notwhereyouare » Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 9:05 PM UTC

miles wrote: post #28

barbazoo wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Elaborate please

‘Zoom is malware’: why experts worry about the video conferencing platform https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2020/apr/02/zoom-tech... Zoom banned from New York City schools due to privacy and security flaws https://www.fastcompany.com/90486586/zoom-banned-from-new-yo... Google Told Its Workers That They Can’t Use Zoom On Their Laptops Anymore https://www.buzzfeednews.com/article/pranavdixit/google-bans... Elon M…

and on the front page currently: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=28210076

Re: Ask HN: Why does Zoom Desktop examine all processes and arguments?

#32

Post by jraph » Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 9:06 PM UTC

phendrenad2 wrote: post #16

akira2501 wrote: post #10

> Is there any way to prevent it? Put it into it's own namespace, and only allow it to connect to your X11 session over TCP.

Does that prevent it from reading from `/proc`?

In a PID namespace [1], it will be able to read /proc, but will see nothing interesting other than a strangely empty system. The process is isolated from the rest of the system as far as processes and PIDs are concerned.

[1] https://www.redhat.com/sysadmin/pid-namespace

Re: Ask HN: Why does Zoom Desktop examine all processes and arguments?

#33

Post by spockz » Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 9:07 PM UTC

egypturnash wrote: post #22

wwweston wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Discord leaks which apps you're using to other people?

So does Steam. It’s... a little creepier when it’s taken beyond “advertise which games you’re playing so your friends can potentially join you”, though.

Steam only does this when you launch an app through steam and only when it is enabled though.

That is quite a difference from broadcasting the name of any binary it recognises.

Re: Ask HN: Why does Zoom Desktop examine all processes and arguments?

#34

Post by jagged-chisel » Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 9:08 PM UTC

> Is there any way to prevent it?

Hook the stat, openat, readlink functions within the zoom process, experiment with blocking (returning failure) based on arguments.

Re: Ask HN: Why does Zoom Desktop examine all processes and arguments?

#35

Post by zzo38computer » Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 9:09 PM UTC

akira2501 wrote: post #10

> Is there any way to prevent it? Put it into it's own namespace, and only allow it to connect to your X11 session over TCP.

If you want to prevent programs from accessing other windows, then (in addition to using its own namespace and file access) you would also need to proxy the X server, or run it in a nested X server (which does not have access to the one outside).

Re: Ask HN: Why does Zoom Desktop examine all processes and arguments?

#36

Post by MattGaiser » Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 9:10 PM UTC

And for people giving ways to prevent it, can you please provide some context for those of us who aren't OS experts?

Re: Ask HN: Why does Zoom Desktop examine all processes and arguments?

#37

Post by dsr_ » Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 9:11 PM UTC

MattGaiser wrote: post #36

And for people giving ways to prevent it, can you please provide some context for those of us who aren't OS experts?

If you must use zoom, use it in a browser; uninstall their app.

Re: Ask HN: Why does Zoom Desktop examine all processes and arguments?

#38

Post by nrabulinski » Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 9:14 PM UTC

wwweston wrote: post #17

tryauuum wrote: post #8

(incompetence here) Maybe it's like discord, it does the same to display messages like "$username is playing terraria right now"

Discord leaks which apps you're using to other people?

It “leaks” which apps you’re using if the developer explicitly talks to the discord client. Discord provides an SDK for game developers etc which can talk to discord client and show the game you’re playing and optionally let you invite people to your lobby straight from the discord chat. It doesn’t scan anything or open any processes, it just opens an IPC socket.

Re: Ask HN: Why does Zoom Desktop examine all processes and arguments?

#39

Post by jraph » Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 9:14 PM UTC

MattGaiser wrote: post #36

And for people giving ways to prevent it, can you please provide some context for those of us who aren't OS experts?

"Zoom does not work on my computer*, can we try X instead?"

With X = something the other end does not need to install, like Jitsi Meet for instance

*no need to explain that's because you uninstalled it and blocked its domain on your computer.

Re: Ask HN: Why does Zoom Desktop examine all processes and arguments?

#40

Post by jraph » Tue, Aug 17, 2021, 9:15 PM UTC

akira2501 wrote: post #14

sithadmin wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This. It enables single-app share, instead of just capturing entire displays.

Unless I'm missing something.. all of the required information is available through the X11 protocol. Reading the command lines of the processes is unnecessary and provides data that isn't useful in the window sharing context.

This would not work on Wayland, though.