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What really happened to Jack Ma?

forbes.com

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Re: What really happened to Jack Ma?

#31

Post by lotsofpulp »

kangaroozach wrote: post #15
stanrivers wrote: post #3

This is an interesting read - I didn’t know how unsubstantiated a lot of the “sightings” of Jack were… was dumb of him to say what he did, but doesn’t warrant the apparent mistreatment

I fault the press for letting this slide. Most people just read headlines and figured he was alright and their theories were proven false. The press should have for skepticism because they act as the middle layer between the public and the reality of what is going on. They have a responsibility to get us the relevant facts. These days seems like the press has sold out and seems like they are in someone’s pocket…

> They have a responsibility to get us the relevant facts.

>These days seems like the press has sold out and seems like they are in someone’s pocket…

We do not want to compensate journalists, and there seems to be quite some risk in doing investigative journalism in China, so I would not expect someone to donate their life as the risk reward ratio is out of whack.

Re: What really happened to Jack Ma?

#32

Post by MrBuddyCasino »

cik wrote: post #27

Colour me paranoid.. but I think I'm a realist. From China's point of view, the creation (and concentration) of (large amounts) of wealth in the hands of individuals, leads to the concentration of power. That power in turn, becomes a threat to the current approach of the CCP, and the messages being shared with society. In 2019, China began working with PWC in an effort to repatriate, or at least dual-list IPOs, in ei…

This is exactly right. Same reason they shut down LGBTQ chat rooms. It will be very interesting to watch the trajectory of China vs the western model.

Re: What really happened to Jack Ma?

#34

Post by kzzzznot »

hulitu wrote: post #28
scandox wrote: post #23

The very excellent effect of Ma's downfall is that it will remind wealthy people in the West that democracy has its good points. Much easier to sympathize with the expropriation of a Billionaire than some schlub from the middle of nowhere.

> The very excellent effect of Ma's downfall is that it will remind wealthy people in the West that democracy has its good points. Yes, like protecting rich criminals. > Much easier to sympathize with the expropriation of a Billionaire than some schlub from the middle of nowhere. Some people never have enough. It is good that sometimes they are shown that limits exist.

Is Jack Ma a criminal?

And to your second point, are you saying that it is good to threaten, silence or disappear wealthy people in case they might become a threat to your authoritarian regime? I suppose from a purely practical point of view yes that might be the best move. We seem to disagree on the ethics of authoritarianism though.

Re: What really happened to Jack Ma?

#35

Post by wsc981 »

genmud wrote: post #5

One thing that you learn quickly when traveling the world is how easily one can go from having a good time with your friends, to being in a shitty prison without food, running water or a phone to let your family know if you are dead or alive. I have friends travel to interesting places during times of (relative) stability. To paraphrase one of the guys that I know: "When you travel in some of these places, you exist…

Somewhat related, this is an interesting story of the escape of a Western guy with his Chinese wife and child from China: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z7CPqROtanA

He did have to escape on short notice after he shared or said something on his YouTube channel that offended the Chinese government (IIRC).

Re: What really happened to Jack Ma?

#36

Post by pjerem »

baybal2 wrote: post #6

It's very likely he can be detained, and let go out with some minders. Just sending him to Gulag would be too much of a bombshell even today, so they perpetuate his "semi-imprisonment" just to not let out people thoughts that capitalism is done for in China.

> It's very likely he can be detained, and let go out with some minders.

Yes but there is the (pretty high, tbh) risk that he would like to leave china as soon as possible and if it happens, he would be able to talk, and be listened.

Re: What really happened to Jack Ma?

#38

Post by ca01an »

genmud wrote: post #5

One thing that you learn quickly when traveling the world is how easily one can go from having a good time with your friends, to being in a shitty prison without food, running water or a phone to let your family know if you are dead or alive. I have friends travel to interesting places during times of (relative) stability. To paraphrase one of the guys that I know: "When you travel in some of these places, you exist…

Most people are more likely to end up in prison in the USA than they are in China

Re: What really happened to Jack Ma?

#39

Post by MattGaiser »

ca01an wrote: post #38
genmud wrote: post #5

One thing that you learn quickly when traveling the world is how easily one can go from having a good time with your friends, to being in a shitty prison without food, running water or a phone to let your family know if you are dead or alive. I have friends travel to interesting places during times of (relative) stability. To paraphrase one of the guys that I know: "When you travel in some of these places, you exist…

Most people are more likely to end up in prison in the USA than they are in China

But not because some government official suddenly decided they should.

In the USA, the rules are known well in advance. There might be questionable rules, but POTUS cannot decree a rule into existence and put a bag over your head an hour later.

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