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In Karachi, hot weather is normal but 44°C feels like you’re going to die

theguardian.com

31–40 of 62 posts

Re: In Karachi, hot weather is normal but 44°C feels like you’re going to die

#31

Unfortunately, this seems to be the new norm. Even in Canada, we are breaking records for heat. Temperatures have reached 49 C / 120 F Despite that, I believe Canada will be a major recipient of these climate refugees when places just get too hot to live in. That'll also be an option reserved for the privileged.

If by norm you mean the slope, yes. If you meant the y intercept, no. Soon it will be hotter. In Karachi and where you live too.

To change the slope, exactly two things work: reducing our consumption and reducing our birth rate. Mechai Viravaidya in Thailand showed how to reduce birth rate in the opposite of China's One Child policy or eugenics -- that is, voluntary, noncoercive, even fun -- as did Costa Rica, Iran, and several other countries. Most Americans can improve their quality of life by lowering consumption. I reduced mine over 90% with just life improvements. I estimate most Americans can reduce theirs 80% or more without sacrifice, just improvements. The most polluting can probably reduce theirs 99%.

Systemic change begins with personal transformation. Government and corporations will follow individual action, as they historically have. Personal transformation enables us to lead others. Leading others has the biggest effect because it multiplies.

Re: In Karachi, hot weather is normal but 44°C feels like you’re going to die

#32
post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The issue with wet bulb temperature is even worse. You don't need to have an average to hit anywhere close to it. Just one single event, wave of temperature over 36 degrees is most likely going to kill millions of people if it hits densely populated area with people having no infrastructure to cool themselves. And no, spraying with water will not help, by very definition.

I guess jumping into a body of water which has a cooler temperature would still help? Jumping into water which is 36 degrees or warmer wouldn't.

It depends because wet bulb temperature is normally significantly below ambient temperature. If ambient temperature was 45C a large body of water might be at 38C while wet bulb was 36C. At which point jumping into the water would be a bad idea.

It really just comes down to infrastructure. It’s possible to prepare for such events, but without large scale preparation they turn deadly.

Re: In Karachi, hot weather is normal but 44°C feels like you’re going to die

#33

If I understand this right, this is not just the heat, but the humidity as well. The UK Daily Telegraph had an article[1] about how nearby Jacobabad crossed the 35C wet bulb reading threshold, at which point — according to the article — the body can no longer cool itself. I assume Karachi isn’t that bad yet. A cursory Google search showed a wet bulb reading of 27C for Karachi — still very hot but not life-threatening…

> I assume Karachi isn’t that bad yet.

Weather or climate? Weather is incidental. In terms of climate, further increases for decades are locked in from past emissions we can't change.

For the present, at each moment, we can choose to contribute to further suffering or not. As you mentioned, it's becoming life-threatening.

Exactly two things work: reducing our consumption and reducing our birth rate. Mechai Viravaidya in Thailand showed how to reduce birth rate in the opposite of China's One Child policy or eugenics -- that is, voluntary, noncoercive, even fun -- as did Costa Rica, Iran, and several other countries. Most Americans can improve their quality of life by lowering consumption. I reduced mine over 90% with just life improvements. I estimate most Americans can reduce theirs 80% or more without sacrifice, just improvements. The most polluting can probably reduce theirs 99%.

Systemic change begins with personal transformation. Government and corporations will follow individual action, as they historically have. Personal transformation enables us to lead others. Leading others has the biggest effect because it multiplies.

To act here and now, the most important thing we can do is to learn leadership skills to lead ourselves and others.

Re: In Karachi, hot weather is normal but 44°C feels like you’re going to die

#34
post #25
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is India. A lot of people just don't live close to a body of water. Getting any water is a huge issue. Can you imagine millions of people running to cool in the river? What with elderly and children?

Pakistan, not India

Obviously, you are right. Thanks.

Re: In Karachi, hot weather is normal but 44°C feels like you’re going to die

#35

Unfortunately, this seems to be the new norm. Even in Canada, we are breaking records for heat. Temperatures have reached 49 C / 120 F Despite that, I believe Canada will be a major recipient of these climate refugees when places just get too hot to live in. That'll also be an option reserved for the privileged.

> Despite that, I believe Canada will be a major recipient of these climate refugees when places just get too hot to live in.

In what sense would these people be climate refugees rather than infrastructure refugees? What percentage of Canada's population can survive in Canada without canada's infrastructure ?

If you read the article, a major problem the author is complaining about is the infrastructure:

> The electricity problems make it worse. The load-shedding comes during summer months and, these days, often falls in Ramadan, when people can’t drink water.

Re: In Karachi, hot weather is normal but 44°C feels like you’re going to die

#36

If I understand this right, this is not just the heat, but the humidity as well. The UK Daily Telegraph had an article[1] about how nearby Jacobabad crossed the 35C wet bulb reading threshold, at which point — according to the article — the body can no longer cool itself. I assume Karachi isn’t that bad yet. A cursory Google search showed a wet bulb reading of 27C for Karachi — still very hot but not life-threatening…

Humidity is the killer at those temperature ranges. Here we got a bit of a micro-climate because of large bodies of water and whenever temperature goes past 25ºC it's already highly uncomfortable, whereas 25ºC in other parts of the country, even the ones known as hot, is rather comfortable. Just a couple kilometers north, 35ºC are barely noticeable in comparison, even under the sun. (Sure makes your skin burn with all the fury of Helios, but it doesn't make you dizzy and tired like a high humidity area does at much lower temps)

Our highest registered temperature was an exceptional peak of 52ºC for two days. Was a bit of a massacre, specially on elders. There's no record of those days publicly for some reason, but all locals remember it well.

The high humidity saturation seems to negatively affect evaporation of sweat, making you constantly drenched even with no clothes on. It's a kind of hell you can't escape, only hope it passes soon.

Re: In Karachi, hot weather is normal but 44°C feels like you’re going to die

#37
Recommended reading about the topic of climate change and wet bulb temperatures:

Kim Stanley Robinson's novel "The Ministry for the Future".

Here's the blurb from goodreads:

Established in 2025, the purpose of the new organization was simple: To advocate for the world's future generations and to protect all living creatures, present and future. It soon became known as the Ministry for the Future, and this is its story.

From legendary science fiction author Kim Stanley Robinson comes a vision of climate change unlike any ever imagined.

Told entirely through fictional eye-witness accounts, The Ministry For The Future is a masterpiece of the imagination, the story of how climate change will affect us all over the decades to come.

Its setting is not a desolate, post-apocalyptic world, but a future that is almost upon us - and in which we might just overcome the extraordinary challenges we face.

It is a novel both immediate and impactful, desperate and hopeful in equal measure, and it is one of the most powerful and original books on climate change ever written.

Re: In Karachi, hot weather is normal but 44°C feels like you’re going to die

#38

The tone of so many articles and comments online seems to be "Shrug, not much we can do about it". Or pedantically arguing about minutia. Between this and the pandemic response in so many places, I'm not so sure humanity is going to be around in a century or two. The rich will live in climate controlled domes on remote islands or ships, while billions of people starve, overheat, or fight over scraps. The global "elit…

It's a race to build self-repairing bots. Once the wealthy have it, they can just go ahead and let most people die.

Re: In Karachi, hot weather is normal but 44°C feels like you’re going to die

#39

The tone of so many articles and comments online seems to be "Shrug, not much we can do about it". Or pedantically arguing about minutia. Between this and the pandemic response in so many places, I'm not so sure humanity is going to be around in a century or two. The rich will live in climate controlled domes on remote islands or ships, while billions of people starve, overheat, or fight over scraps. The global "elit…

It's a race to build self-repairing bots. Once the wealthy have it, they can just go ahead and let most people die.

self-repairing is only a small part.

bots would have to be just as useful/cost-effective as poor humans. Apparently manual labour at $2/hr is cheaper than robots still.

Re: In Karachi, hot weather is normal but 44°C feels like you’re going to die

#40

The tone of so many articles and comments online seems to be "Shrug, not much we can do about it". Or pedantically arguing about minutia. Between this and the pandemic response in so many places, I'm not so sure humanity is going to be around in a century or two. The rich will live in climate controlled domes on remote islands or ships, while billions of people starve, overheat, or fight over scraps. The global "elit…

Wasn’t there an article on HN last we re lab food obviating farming? I’ll go look...

Aha... https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=27723001

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