Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee' • Hacker News Board

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#31

Post by api » Tue, Jun 22, 2021, 2:12 PM UTC

jerf wrote: post #23

'The company has cited "safety and well-being" as a reason for introducing the membership fee.' I've noticed the "fake because" lately seems to be getting more and more brazen from corporations. This is about the third or fourth "for your safety and convenience we're helping ourselves to more of your money" I've seen in the last couple months, and unfortunately all the other ones I've seen are for products or service…

Running with a heavy wallet is dangerous. You're more likely to lose your balance and any fall would be that much worse due to the added weight. Peloton is helpfully making your wallet lighter to ensure a safe running experience.

Seriously though: if something doesn't really need it, any form of Internet-enabling is something I see as an anti-feature and now avoid at all costs. Internet enabled features or apps means "it spies on you, will change or break needlessly due to an update, or will find a way to extract rent." I will pay more for something without Wifi or (worse) a fucking cellular modem.

I'm worried about the ability to buy a non-Internet-enabled car though. I have a 2013 Nissan Leaf and am looking into upgrading its battery. The car is otherwise absolutely perfect. It just needs more range per charge.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#32

Post by sellyme » Tue, Jun 22, 2021, 2:13 PM UTC

darkcha0s wrote: post #4

aliasEli wrote: post #2

Hardware changes slower than software. Some very influential software companies (e.g. Microsoft, Adobe) switched to a subscription model some time ago. From a marketing perspective it seems to make sense. If your customers pay a lot of money to buy your product and don't hesitate to connect it to the internet, they are probably wealthy but not very intelligent. Ideal marks for a subscription service.

What kind of weird ass psychoanalysis is this? People who pay money for products and connect them to the internet are stupid and have money?

> People who pay money for products and connect them to the internet are stupid and have money?

If you can buy a $3k treadmill, you have money (although about $3k less of it, in fairness).

If you think your treadmill needs to be connected to the internet, you are not particularly intelligent.

Neither of these are controversial takes. We've had enough experience with IoT devices being absolutely god-awful to know this.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#33

Post by sys_64738 » Tue, Jun 22, 2021, 2:14 PM UTC

api wrote: post #30

sys_64738 wrote: post #26

How can a lump of hardware require a subscription to work? I've been in a coma for 20 years.

Every company wants recurring revenue: https://www.datagubbe.se/endofownership/

Why don't we have this with computers? Surely we're depriving Lenovo and Apple of such revenue if we use the computer and don't pay a monthly fee? This whole sub thing is nuts.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#34

Post by api » Tue, Jun 22, 2021, 2:14 PM UTC

wrycoder wrote: post #8

Corporations love the steady revenue of the subscription model. Look at Blackrock buying up all the housing and renting it out. The idea being that people won’t own anything except (maybe) their clothes. Well, certainly a lot less trouble for the kids when you kick off.

Investors are starting to value companies exclusively off recurring revenue. Non-subscription revenue is not even counted.

If your company has $100000/month in MRR but manages to make $100M in a year, it's a $1.2M/year company.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#35

Post by nradov » Tue, Jun 22, 2021, 2:14 PM UTC

jen20 wrote: post #18

randshift wrote: post #11

The title of this article is somewhat silly to me. The subscription fee has never been a surprise to anyone who's owned one. The point of a Peloton is to do the classes, either for running or spinning, which require a subscription. It would be silly to buy a premium device who's point is to use the subscription based features and specifically intend to use it without the subscription. Just buy a similar treadmill fro…

> subscription. It would be silly to buy a premium device who's point is to use the subscription based features and specifically intend to use it without the subscription. What if they go out of business?

I suppose that's always a risk but Peloton is in a strong financial position. They're highly unlikely to go out of business within the expected lifespan of a treadmill.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#36

Post by kevstev » Tue, Jun 22, 2021, 2:15 PM UTC

Barrin92 wrote: post #7

I mean the entire business model of the company seems to be to depart rich people from their money in obscene ways, so that move does not seem unexpected. I generally do not understand the thought process of buying a tablet glued to a treadmill for three thousand dollars. That's like what, a decade of gym membership

These are competing with fitness studios like Soul Cycle- which charges $40+ a class after shoe rental and water. The bike is more like $2000 at least for the standard bike, not $3000.

My wife bought one in November 2019, and both joined the "century club" (100 rides) by the middle of 2020 and she takes the Yoga classes as well and I have done a few strength classes- its not just about the bike. We had never previously had a gym membership, though I would use the one in my previous apartment building, and my wife was into both Yoga classes and Soul Cycle.

I hate group fitness and cycle studios, and am currently on a 65+ week streak on Peloton. The value is there for me, and even outside the pandemic, my wife hasn't stepped foot in a cycle studio since it was delivered.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#37

Post by everdrive » Tue, Jun 22, 2021, 2:17 PM UTC

Every service, or product that relies on a service can either be taken from you, or have its terms changed. You'll have no recourse, or else your recourse will be a lengthy class action lawsuit, which may still result in an unsatisfactory resolution for the consumer.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#38

Post by anm89 » Tue, Jun 22, 2021, 2:18 PM UTC

aliasEli wrote: post #2

Hardware changes slower than software. Some very influential software companies (e.g. Microsoft, Adobe) switched to a subscription model some time ago. From a marketing perspective it seems to make sense. If your customers pay a lot of money to buy your product and don't hesitate to connect it to the internet, they are probably wealthy but not very intelligent. Ideal marks for a subscription service.

It's funny, this is the basis of many Nigerian scams. Make the scam as dumb as possible so you are guaranteed that the people who respond are self selecting as the most oblivious people in society.

Pelton has managed to identify the exact set of people who are rich, oblivious, and like fitness.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#39

Post by _jal » Tue, Jun 22, 2021, 2:18 PM UTC

randshift wrote: post #11

The title of this article is somewhat silly to me. The subscription fee has never been a surprise to anyone who's owned one. The point of a Peloton is to do the classes, either for running or spinning, which require a subscription. It would be silly to buy a premium device who's point is to use the subscription based features and specifically intend to use it without the subscription. Just buy a similar treadmill fro…

> It would be silly to buy a premium device who's point is to use the subscription

I think you could have stopped there.

The business model appears to be: sell an expensive hostage, justify ramping up recurring ransoms by threatening to kill the hostage.

Re: Peloton's $3k treadmill now comes with surprise 'subscription fee'

#40

Post by globular-toast » Tue, Jun 22, 2021, 2:20 PM UTC

Barrin92 wrote: post #7

I mean the entire business model of the company seems to be to depart rich people from their money in obscene ways, so that move does not seem unexpected. I generally do not understand the thought process of buying a tablet glued to a treadmill for three thousand dollars. That's like what, a decade of gym membership

It targets a similar customer to that obscenely expensive juice squeezer thing.

I'm noticing more and more a trend for people to spend seemingly large amounts of money on completely pointless things. Out of curiosity I checked how much people are spending on custom number plates for their cars in the UK. They are regularly going for tens of thousands of pounds. For a few numbers that other people get to see on their cars.

My theory is, despite the nominal amounts being very high, the opportunity cost to the buyers is very low, but it's not because they are "rich". There is such a huge gulf between being "well off" and being "rich" that it's quite easy for many people to save up a spare ten thousand and just not have anything better to spend it on. To make serious life changes, like a new house, you need hundreds of thousands to millions. Suddenly that ten thousand is a drop in the ocean. Faced with not a chance of ever reaching "rich", people remain "well off" and spend these paradoxically large but tiny amounts of money on pointless things.