When we are no longer restricted by resource limits as a society, everything quickly becomes an addiction. Food, alcohol, cigarettes, caffeine, sex, drugs, gambling, shopping, TV, video games, social media. I'm sure people a lot more qualified than me will be able to talk about it in scientific terms, but I feel like a certain category of species (maybe all of them?) simply never ran into limiting excesses as part of their evolution. There are animals that will literally eat themselves to death if given the chance.
America has a drinking problem
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Re: America has a drinking problem
#32I found it pretty amusing to see how drunk our founding fathers were. I think being drunk played a huge role in the American revolution
I'd love to see a drunk history about drunken Washington infecting his drunken troops with cowpox (sober cows).
Re: America has a drinking problem
#33“ In his 1979 history, The Alcoholic Republic, the historian W. J. Rorabaugh painstakingly calculated the stunning amount of alcohol early Americans drank on a daily basis. In 1830, when American liquor consumption hit its all-time high, the average adult was going through more than nine gallons of spirits each year.”
I think I remember hearing a similar stat on the ken burns prohibition doc. I didn’t quite understand why it was supposed to be that much though. 9 gallons of liquor is 36 liters is roughly 100 bottles of wine equivalent per year so less than a third of a bottle of wine a day which is what 1 or 2 glasses per meal equivalent? So the question then is are people drinking liquor drinking wine on top plus cider apparently? Or is it just a lot because that’s the average and plenty of people aren’t drinking much at or at all and that makes for the right tail of the distribution to be really drinking a lot?
Re: America has a drinking problem
#34Earlier quoted context omitted.
As someone who doesn't drink more than 2-3 per week and have in the past been in the 2-3 per day category, perhaps it's related to age and/or kids. When kids were tots, I couldn't afford the time to socialize, and now I'm older, consumption has dietary/sleep impacts and I can't afford that too much. Also weirdly I simply don't enjoy the buzz as much.
I also drink about this much per week. I like a beer or wine or whiskey every now and again, but I've never really seen the point in getting buzzed or drunk (or high for that matter). When I do drink, I only have 1 or 2 at a time, not out of an express desire to stay sober, but because I'm usually pretty naturally satisfied by that amount. For whatever reason, I like sobriety. It's strange to me that people should th…
>as though escaping or distorting reality is inherently preferable. Maybe I equally misunderstand the motives of the heavy drinker?
You understand the motives just fine. Reality for many people is some combination of boring, stressful, depressing, etc.
So yes, escaping reality is very much preferable to these people. And alcohol and other drugs are very effective at this.
To state the obvious, improving your situation so you don't want to escape reality would be preferable. But that takes a hell of a lot more time, motivation, resources, and effort than just cracking open that next beer.
Re: America has a drinking problem
#35The statistics about alcohol consumption are so stunning that I often wonder how accurate they are. If these numbers are correct, the top 10% of alcohol drinkers consume the equivalent of 10 drinks per day : https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/wonk/wp/2014/09/25/think... The unit for a single drink is a fixed measurement, so someone pouring a tall glass of wine or a very stiff drink could be consuming 2-5 “drinks” in…
It sounds like a lot but I know lots of people in rural areas with extreme poverty (grew up in one of the poorest counties in the midwest) where this sort of drinking was commonplace. They drink as soon as they wake up and don't stop until they fall asleep. Anecdotal I know but certainly believable for me.
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Re: America has a drinking problem
#36Earlier quoted context omitted.
I also drink about this much per week. I like a beer or wine or whiskey every now and again, but I've never really seen the point in getting buzzed or drunk (or high for that matter). When I do drink, I only have 1 or 2 at a time, not out of an express desire to stay sober, but because I'm usually pretty naturally satisfied by that amount. For whatever reason, I like sobriety. It's strange to me that people should th…
>as though escaping or distorting reality is inherently preferable. Maybe I equally misunderstand the motives of the heavy drinker? You understand the motives just fine. Reality for many people is some combination of boring, stressful, depressing, etc. So yes, escaping reality is very much preferable to these people. And alcohol and other drugs are very effective at this. To state the obvious, improving your situatio…
> To state the obvious, improving your situation so you don't want to escape reality would be preferable. But that takes a hell of a lot more time, motivation, resources, and effort than just cracking open that next beer.
To that extent, I've gone through some very hard times (for me anyway--not interested in comparing traumas), and for whatever reason much of my cultural upbringing suggested I should reach for some whiskey; however, ultimately I was just too aware that that wouldn't fix my hurt and that "the only way through it was through it" cliche was ultimately true. What really got me through was accepting reality and acknowledging that even though reality was painful, avoiding pain isn't the objective in life (or that's my moral philosophy, anyway)--enduring a trial well is life-affirming. Embrace reality, truth, etc even if it sucks.
EDIT: "everything in my cultural upbringing" -> "much of my cultural upbringing". On reflection, I think the philosophy which allowed me to be successful was largely traditional, Judeo-Christian philosophy which permeates much of American culture. Credit where due.
Re: America has a drinking problem
#37Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I'm not suggesting outlawing. I'm suggesting no longer supporting. That sounds like doublespeak. Either you allow something or you don't. Not allowing drinking in parks falls firmly in the "outlawing" category. I can't speak for other countries but in the USA smoking has always been allowed in open public spaces and still is. In fact most states don't even have laws banning it in indoors. Cigarette boxes have no gr…
My example was of a municipality (Canada) that designated a place where it previously wasn't allowed to drink alcohol to be allowed. That's what I meant by "supporting". At least don't expand the options.
Due to COVID-19, people couldn't drink their healthy moderation where they usually do.
Re: America has a drinking problem
#38I found it pretty amusing to see how drunk our founding fathers were. I think being drunk played a huge role in the American revolution
"When Britain taxed our TEA we got frisky/
Imagine what gon' happen when you try & tax our whiskey"
Re: America has a drinking problem
#39I’ve never been much of a drinker, generally preferring soda, sports drinks, or sweet tea to stay hydrated. In my experience, this is unusual. My friends, relatives, etc. all exclusively drink beer when doing yard work, home improvement projects, or hobbies like working on cars. When I’m at the marina, I’m the only one not drinking beer while working on their boat. Maybe all of these people stick exclusively to water…
You're kind of like me, I simply do not enjoy doing any sort of work in a "buzzed" state so I never day drink at all. Not once have I been working on something in the middle of the day and thought "a beer would make this better" because I find the state to be distracting and the opposite of what coffee does for me in terms of motivation and focus. I spent years in co-working spaces with beer on tap and simply didn't indulge, it's not a will power thing or discipline I just don't want it. I'm not an alcohol hater either I'll still "go wild" with friends once in a while at a bar or club to make myself extroverted.
Re: America has a drinking problem
#40I found it pretty amusing to see how drunk our founding fathers were. I think being drunk played a huge role in the American revolution
Going back further, I'd love to know the source of the claim that the Mayflower was diverted from the mouth of the Hudson to Plymouth Rock because the ship was running low on beer. It seems like the sort of thing that would be more widely known.