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Zoom will pay zero federal taxes due to tax credits from previous years

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Re: Zoom will pay zero federal taxes due to tax credits from previous years

#31

Post by rs999gti »

pjc50 wrote: post #18
question000 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this sarcasm? Why wouldn't I still be outraged? Because they have "tax credits". Okay can I as individual get tax credits by going into debt? If I can't "tax credits" then Zoom shouldn't get them. It's just common sense. Seriously the current tax structure in the United States seems to be anti-human being. Humans have to pay up front in cash 100% each year, corporations can just claim they are writing off debt, ap…

Individuals are not taxed on a "profit and loss" basis.

> Individuals are not taxed on a "profit and loss" basis.

Is it safe to assume you have no investments or save for retirement?

Re: Zoom will pay zero federal taxes due to tax credits from previous years

#32

Post by ephextom »

question000 wrote: post #17
zpeti wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But hey, at least we got thousands of clicks from outraged people about tech companies not paying taxes? KPIs met! Win!

Is this sarcasm? Why wouldn't I still be outraged? Because they have "tax credits". Okay can I as individual get tax credits by going into debt? If I can't "tax credits" then Zoom shouldn't get them. It's just common sense. Seriously the current tax structure in the United States seems to be anti-human being. Humans have to pay up front in cash 100% each year, corporations can just claim they are writing off debt, ap…

> Seriously the current tax structure in the United States seems to be anti-human being

Companies are groups of human beings, earning income collectively. Corporate income taxes wouldn't be needed if the tax system was effective at tracking all financial flows. If the system worked properly, we'd just tax the money when it was paid to individuals as salary or dividends, which has to happen for it to be used by people; it's no good to anyone just sitting in a company bank account doing nothing.

The focus on company income tax is just a media trick to get people enraged, but it really is a non issue. Big companies generate huge amounts of taxes by merely exisiting, because they move huge amounts of money around that ends up in the hands of other companies and individuals, and plenty of tax gets paid when that happens.

Re: Zoom will pay zero federal taxes due to tax credits from previous years

#33

Post by rs999gti »

jokethrowaway wrote: post #10

Really rich people will always find some way to get loopholes enshrined in law or find a foreign country willing to do it. There is no way around. The only people paying disproportionately more in taxes are middle class people. Incidentally that also helps rich people by having less competition at the top. If you want fairness, no-one should be forced to pay taxes, everyone should pay for the services they use and th…

>If you want fairness, no-one should be forced to pay taxes

Agree

> everyone should pay for the services they use

Usage taxes and VATs are always voted down because they hit poor and middle class the hardest, at least in the US.

> and there should be no corruptible centralised entity who can decide for everyone.

But muh roadz!

Re: Zoom will pay zero federal taxes due to tax credits from previous years

#34

Post by ephextom »

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #29
bkirkby wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you, as an individual, provide the value of a Zoom that benefits society? Are you paying thousands of people a salary (paying taxes on their salary)? Are you providing a service that people are using to, ostensibly, make their lives better? If so, you should incorporate +and probably already do if you happen to employ thousands of people) since laws around incorporating are there to encourage people to take the r…

If companies are the lifeblood of the country, then the government is the bones. It provides absolutely necessary infrastructure like roads, water, sewers, and law enforcement. It provides economic and social stability through fiscal controls and food subsidies. It provides an educated population through schools. When viewed this way, the vitriol arising from a large company not paying taxes makes sense. The entire o…

The point is they do pay all kinds of taxes; the more they spend in a year, the more taxes are generated (as I said, employee income taxes, franchise taxes, sales taxes, etc etc etc).

Federal income tax is just one of the many taxes that companies are subjected to, and one that innovative companies normally don't pay anyway because it's not good business to hoard profits, it's much better to invest for future growth, leading to more of all the other kinds of taxes being generated now and into the future.

These rage-bait articles that always focus on corporate income tax only work because many people aren't aware of this.

Re: Zoom will pay zero federal taxes due to tax credits from previous years

#35

Post by datavirtue »

The real travesty is the excessive regulation preventing innovation and generally slowing the speed of business. If it were not for all the unnessesary ham-fisted regulation that currently exists small businesses and entrepreneurs would be better positioned to enter various markets. But no, in addition to governmental testing of baby cribs you have a government that also tests the amount of force required to light a match or the noise level of a child's cap gun.

We have an epic event based around automobile safety that turbo charged government regulation and created a new bureaucracy that found that there was no safety concern regarding the very car that was used for establishing that very bureaucracy.

By all means, keep complaining about taxes and regulation. They sure could use another round of debate.

Re: Zoom will pay zero federal taxes due to tax credits from previous years

#36

Post by datavirtue »

TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #24
bkirkby wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A strategy that grew their capacity to provide value to the world. The economy is more complex than "look, money, let's take it for government."

Yes, and they've been rewarded with profits and a soaring stock price. Why shouldn't they pay taxes for that? It's undoubtable that they used federal and public infrastructure in the process of making and growing the company.

Then again, why should the entity be punished for creating value and jobs and competition? Please tell.

I guarantee all the people involved were taxed. I would rest a lot easier knowing that the organization that employs me didn't have to worry about taxes. Instead it has to employ an army of people just pay them. Double taxed, everyone is.

Re: Zoom will pay zero federal taxes due to tax credits from previous years

#37

Post by datavirtue »

refurb wrote: post #4
incrudible wrote: post #2

Fact check: True, but misleading. I'll cite: "The biggest reason for Zoom's de minimis tax bill is outsized executive compensation. Zoom paid $580 million in stock compensation alone in 2020, much of it likely to a handful of top executives, according to a calculation by CBS MoneyWatch based on the company's latest financial filings." At some point, somebody will have to pay taxes on selling that stock. Or if they ne…

Did they really write “likely to a handful of top executives”. Stock compensation is pretty typical for tech companies. But as long as they put “likely” in front of that statement they felt it was appropriate? I mean, they could look at 10-Ks. To see how the executive are compensated.

Fact checking and editing has fallen out of favor in the age of facebook headline sharing.

Re: Zoom will pay zero federal taxes due to tax credits from previous years

#38

Post by Shadonototro »

f6v wrote: post #8
keenreed wrote: post #5

My understanding is Zoom is a chinese company. Federal government under Trump was not ready for pandemic, it did not provide any infrastructure for remote learning or work from home. Instead you relied on free infrastructure provided by China. Federal government should pay to Zoom!!!

My school(in Europe) used MS Teams. I’d argue you didn’t HAVE to go with Zoom.

what a shame microsoft infected EU with their products

EU leaders should be ashamed, nothing was done to promote EU products

specially in education sector where it's super hard for private companies to get credits, it's always microsoft, for some reasons..

Re: Zoom will pay zero federal taxes due to tax credits from previous years

#39

Post by rhino369 »

erhk wrote: post #16
zpeti wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But hey, at least we got thousands of clicks from outraged people about tech companies not paying taxes? KPIs met! Win!

Why should income tax be a substitute? Where is my subsidy for having gone into debt for a degree?

There are some deductions for tuition and student loan interest. But I do think that student loan payments should be fully deductible against income.

Re: Zoom will pay zero federal taxes due to tax credits from previous years

#40

Post by f6v »

Shadonototro wrote: post #38
f6v wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My school(in Europe) used MS Teams. I’d argue you didn’t HAVE to go with Zoom.

what a shame microsoft infected EU with their products EU leaders should be ashamed, nothing was done to promote EU products specially in education sector where it's super hard for private companies to get credits, it's always microsoft, for some reasons..

> EU leaders should be ashamed, nothing was done to promote EU products

What would they do it for? Inaction is the best course of action for such a bureaucracy.

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