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José Epita Mbomo, a Spanish electrician who sabotaged the Nazis

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Re: José Epita Mbomo, a Spanish electrician who sabotaged the Nazis

#31

Post by Mediterraneo10 »

stevenjohns wrote: post #26
Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rest of the Spanish-speaking world is unaware, too. I am foreigner who learned Spanish of Spain, and when traveling in Latin America the locals have often made fun of me for using the vosotros form of verbs. "There are umpteen Spanish-speaking countries, and only one says vosotros ," they'd say. "Not true!" I would try to defend myself. "They use vosotros in Western Sahara and Equatorial Guinea, too!" (On my firs…

They use vosotros in Colombia as well, specifically in Medellín and a couple of other places in the "coffee axis," i.e as far out as Manizales.

Do you have some kind of citation to back that up? The only information I can find says that Colombia uses vos (like several other regions in Latin America) and not vosotros.

Re: José Epita Mbomo, a Spanish electrician who sabotaged the Nazis

#32

Post by capableweb »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #28
Zardoz84 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He didn't had the effort to read the article. If not, he will found this : > "In 1968, Epita tore up his communist membership card while watching Soviet tanks crush the Prague Spring on TV." Every body should remember that one thing it's communism and other authoritarian communism regimes. I'm pro-communist, but I'm against any kind of authoritarian government (and so, I see Stalin as a hideous dictator like was Hitl…

> I'm pro-communist, but I'm against any kind of authoritarian government Communism necessarily implies authoritarian government. What you think you believe in is a false utopianism due to a lack of erudition.

> Communism necessarily implies authoritarian government

What? Since when and in what way?

The common definition of Communism is where all participants are sharing the ownership of production and trying to remove things like money and financial class. Many ideas in Communism in fact assumes the absence of any kind of central government.

Then that the states that have tried "Communism" in modern haven't actually aimed for any of the original goals is less important. But let's not change meaning of words willy nilly like you did here.

Re: José Epita Mbomo, a Spanish electrician who sabotaged the Nazis

#33

Post by dieortin »

refraincomment wrote: post #30
MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #14

“I can’t say for sure, but it is likely that he participated in all that,” says his grandson, Yvan Mbomo, who has formed a picture of his grandfather as a communist of such firm convictions that he put the fight for his ideals before his family’s safety and his own. I guess we should celebrate that he was a fan of the right kind of murderous authoritarian ideology.

[flagged]

Didn’t expect to see people talking about “owning” people in HN. A bit sad.

Re: José Epita Mbomo, a Spanish electrician who sabotaged the Nazis

#34

Post by rigoleto »

stevenjohns wrote: post #26
Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The rest of the Spanish-speaking world is unaware, too. I am foreigner who learned Spanish of Spain, and when traveling in Latin America the locals have often made fun of me for using the vosotros form of verbs. "There are umpteen Spanish-speaking countries, and only one says vosotros ," they'd say. "Not true!" I would try to defend myself. "They use vosotros in Western Sahara and Equatorial Guinea, too!" (On my firs…

They use vosotros in Colombia as well, specifically in Medellín and a couple of other places in the "coffee axis," i.e as far out as Manizales.

Vos, not vosotros

Re: José Epita Mbomo, a Spanish electrician who sabotaged the Nazis

#35

Post by anthk »

MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #28
Zardoz84 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He didn't had the effort to read the article. If not, he will found this : > "In 1968, Epita tore up his communist membership card while watching Soviet tanks crush the Prague Spring on TV." Every body should remember that one thing it's communism and other authoritarian communism regimes. I'm pro-communist, but I'm against any kind of authoritarian government (and so, I see Stalin as a hideous dictator like was Hitl…

> I'm pro-communist, but I'm against any kind of authoritarian government Communism necessarily implies authoritarian government. What you think you believe in is a false utopianism due to a lack of erudition.

[flagged]

Re: José Epita Mbomo, a Spanish electrician who sabotaged the Nazis

#36

Post by Mediterraneo10 »

capableweb wrote: post #32
MrBuddyCasino wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm pro-communist, but I'm against any kind of authoritarian government Communism necessarily implies authoritarian government. What you think you believe in is a false utopianism due to a lack of erudition.

> Communism necessarily implies authoritarian government What? Since when and in what way? The common definition of Communism is where all participants are sharing the ownership of production and trying to remove things like money and financial class. Many ideas in Communism in fact assumes the absence of any kind of central government. Then that the states that have tried "Communism" in modern haven't actually aimed…

The OP's claim that communism implies authoritarian government is likely based on the concept of the "dictatorship of the proletariat" in Marxism, and this is a quite common view [0]:

"In The Road to Serfdom (1944), the Austrian School economist Friedrich Hayek wrote that the dictatorship of the proletariat likely would destroy personal freedom as completely as does an autocracy. The European Commission of Human Rights found pursuing the dictatorship of the proletariat incompatible with the European Convention on Human Rights in Communist Party of Germany v. the Federal Republic of Germany (1957)."

Of course, Marxism is just one version of communism among several.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dictatorship_of_the_proletaria...

Re: José Epita Mbomo, a Spanish electrician who sabotaged the Nazis

#37

Post by lucian1900 »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #36
capableweb wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Communism necessarily implies authoritarian government What? Since when and in what way? The common definition of Communism is where all participants are sharing the ownership of production and trying to remove things like money and financial class. Many ideas in Communism in fact assumes the absence of any kind of central government. Then that the states that have tried "Communism" in modern haven't actually aimed…

The OP's claim that communism implies authoritarian government is likely based on the concept of the "dictatorship of the proletariat" in Marxism, and this is a quite common view [0]: "In The Road to Serfdom (1944), the Austrian School economist Friedrich Hayek wrote that the dictatorship of the proletariat likely would destroy personal freedom as completely as does an autocracy. The European Commission of Human Righ…

Even that is frequently (and often wilfully) misinterpreted.

The dictatorship of the proletariat is contrasted to the current dictatorship of the bourgeoisie. It just means that workers are collectively the ruling class in socialist countries, as opposed to owners (of capital) in capitalist countries.

Re: José Epita Mbomo, a Spanish electrician who sabotaged the Nazis

#38

Post by Tossitto »

Mediterraneo10 wrote: post #36
capableweb wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Communism necessarily implies authoritarian government What? Since when and in what way? The common definition of Communism is where all participants are sharing the ownership of production and trying to remove things like money and financial class. Many ideas in Communism in fact assumes the absence of any kind of central government. Then that the states that have tried "Communism" in modern haven't actually aimed…

The OP's claim that communism implies authoritarian government is likely based on the concept of the "dictatorship of the proletariat" in Marxism, and this is a quite common view [0]: "In The Road to Serfdom (1944), the Austrian School economist Friedrich Hayek wrote that the dictatorship of the proletariat likely would destroy personal freedom as completely as does an autocracy. The European Commission of Human Righ…

Seems to me like network effects and a command economy would fall well under the definition of authoritarian.

Re: José Epita Mbomo, a Spanish electrician who sabotaged the Nazis

#39

Post by eyko »

iagovar wrote: post #27
eyko wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I know, that is correct. However, apart from real estate being built, there also seems to be some heavy investment in infrastructure and they're trying to attract investors. I've also heard that there are plans to grow the tourism sector. The elite has also grown in numbers and there seems to be a growing middle class (mostly Fang diaspora going back) with connections to the regime. I don't know what the re…

I see, thanks. I'm sorry for the amount of questions, but I'm very curious! Do you see the ruling elite technically qualified for such leap? And if they are not themselves, are they hiring adequate decision makers, engineers and such? Also, is there an education system in place (or in advanced planning) that allows to grow local technical talent?

I'd say it's complicated. Corruption and nepotism is a fact of life in E. Guinea. It's a society with many layers, all in service of the Nguema "dynasty", if I may describe it as such. The elite tend to send their children and relatives to study abroad, sometimes in prestigious schools, so there are many who are well educated and probably capable of leading and successfully carrying out large scale projects (and they do have some experience working abroad in positions of responsibility), but back home it's a system that doesn't foster healthy competition or reward the effort.

Education is also improving fortunately. The country never had a university until the 90s and now there are plans for a few extra campuses (still one university I believe), and I've seen some "propaganda" videos[4] where they seem to paint an optimistic picture of the future -- if we're to believe that.

Most infrastructure projects are carried out by foreign firms, and China has a very strong presence. For instance, the new planned capital, Ciudad de la Paz, was designed by a Portuguese firm[1] and, and the construction itself is apparently being carried out by a Chinese group[2][3].

One could say that the approach they're taking is very similar to what you'd expect from China: huge government spending, but tight control over the economy. I'm not sure if that model is sustainable but we'll see...

Feel free to get in touch. My twitter username is the same as my username here and my DMs are open!

1. https://www.fat.pt/projecto/nova-capital-da-guine-equatorial... 2. http://csci.cscec.com/en/yyfw/Construction/202006/3109352.ht... 3. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KBY6r2Z3yeY 4. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=feyllyLVZ-E

Re: José Epita Mbomo, a Spanish electrician who sabotaged the Nazis

#40

Post by iagovar »

eyko wrote: post #39
iagovar wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see, thanks. I'm sorry for the amount of questions, but I'm very curious! Do you see the ruling elite technically qualified for such leap? And if they are not themselves, are they hiring adequate decision makers, engineers and such? Also, is there an education system in place (or in advanced planning) that allows to grow local technical talent?

I'd say it's complicated. Corruption and nepotism is a fact of life in E. Guinea. It's a society with many layers, all in service of the Nguema "dynasty", if I may describe it as such. The elite tend to send their children and relatives to study abroad, sometimes in prestigious schools, so there are many who are well educated and probably capable of leading and successfully carrying out large scale projects (and they…

Hey man, thank you a lot, I really appreciate your insight!

I've already followed you in Twitter :) Por ahora no tengo más preguntas, le seguiré la pista a los links, a ver a dónde me llevan, gracias!

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