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How the US Legalized Corruption

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Re: How the US Legalized Corruption

#31

Post by bichiliad »

CapmCrackaWaka wrote: post #25
bichiliad wrote: post #16

To the comments that discredit the article for "bringing race into" the discussion, it's worth noting that: 1. the author is not white, nor lives in a place where white people are any sort of majority. 2. politics has largely been dominated by white people for much of America's history, so it's likely fair that these patterns were started and perpetuated by white people. 3. the author doesn't exempt non-white politic…

1) Why does any of this matter? Perspective? 2) Sure, but are these patterns unique to white people? In America, sure, but what about corruption in Africa, China, Brazil, pick one. 3) Then why bring race into it? Surely saying something along the lines of 'white people are corrupt... But other races don't get a pass' is only inflammatory and does not help the discussion. 4) Sure, but you can have valid points and dis…

I think the point I'm trying to get at is that from his perspective, America is white and is run largely by white people. Corruption exists everywhere, but Americans are in the practice of being complacent with it. I feel like a conversation about how we've normalized corruption needs to die on the altar of civility. The people benefiting from corruption certainly don't care.

Re: How the US Legalized Corruption

#32

Post by Tade0 »

bichiliad wrote: post #16

To the comments that discredit the article for "bringing race into" the discussion, it's worth noting that: 1. the author is not white, nor lives in a place where white people are any sort of majority. 2. politics has largely been dominated by white people for much of America's history, so it's likely fair that these patterns were started and perpetuated by white people. 3. the author doesn't exempt non-white politic…

Americans are not the only white people out there.

I'm eastern-European, we have regular corruption around here and I see no correlation between that and my skin tone.

Re: How the US Legalized Corruption

#33

Post by DaniloDias »

CapmCrackaWaka wrote: post #3

Ugh why bring race into this... Even if the author makes good points, he's not going to convince anyone by saying 'white people have funny words for bribes' in the first paragraph. This is coming from someone who 100% agrees with the rest of the article. Still, I won't share this with anyone I respect.

There is a younger generation that has absolutely no attachment to sincere individualism or ethics. We are functionally divorced from them. There is no voice that is advocating for self-reliance and individualism.

These people believe that racism is systemic. They believe it is evil to judge anyone who is not European or Asian by the color of their skin. But they also know that deep in the hearts of Europeans, all white people are racist and they can’t do anything about it. They sincerely think the world will be better if a generation of white boys going through puberty are forced to acknowledge their privilege and stfu. This will not end well, but some people need to see the explosion before they change course. Keep an eye on the national suicide rates and ask yourself how this new way of thinking is working out.

The only way this world view makes sense is if you are shallow conformist. Too many people are too afraid of being labeled racist to address the inconsistency and racism of our national dialog on race.

We normalize irrational and self-destructive behavior as a psychological condition that should be accepted because we need to “have a conversation about mental health.” Ted Kazinsky was right about the evolution of our culture and our dependency on technology to replace analytical thinking. Listen to the Sofia with an F podcast. We are in the middle of a philosophical divorce, and the next generation is focused exclusively on medications and DSM diagnostics over personal growth.

We are industrial scale farming over-socialized, undereducated adults. Some day, their generation gets the launch codes. They are going to destroy themselves but they won’t be able to recognize their role because everything is someone else’s fault.

Re: How the US Legalized Corruption

#34

Post by wpietri »

CapmCrackaWaka wrote: post #3

Ugh why bring race into this... Even if the author makes good points, he's not going to convince anyone by saying 'white people have funny words for bribes' in the first paragraph. This is coming from someone who 100% agrees with the rest of the article. Still, I won't share this with anyone I respect.

As a fellow white person, I get this is uncomfortable. But they're not bringing race into this. It's been here all along. Because white people put it there.

Right from the beginning America's constitution was built on white power over black people. [1] Slaves helped build the White House. [2] We fought a civil war to end slavery, but gave up on Reconstruction, [3] leading to the Nadir. [4] After the Nadir, we had Jim Crow in the south and widespread ethnic cleansing elsewhere [6][7]. [5] As with Reconstruction, we had some improvement with the Civil Rights movement, but now reasonable people see us as being in a second Nadir, [6][7] and that the recent collapse in bipartisan comity is just more fallout from attempts to move toward racial equity. [8]

You could look at the pictures of presidents and see it's been very white. [9] Or take senators. There have been 11 black senators [10] out of 1994 senators total [11], a worse ratio than presidents. This is not an accident; it's something that white people have worked very hard for, from the US Constitution to the Wilmington Coup [12] to a former president who vigorously promoted racist lies and ended up trying to disenfranchise large black cities wholesale. [13]

Whiteness has a pervasive influence on America's history and still does today. And until white people can at least hear mention of that whiteness without putting their hands over their ears, we're going to keep having some of the same problems over and over. That especially includes problems in the political system, a major function of which has been to ensure continued white dominance.

[1] https://www.britannica.com/topic/three-fifths-compromise

[2] https://www.whitehousehistory.org/press-room/press-backgroun...

[3] https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2015/10/what-if...

[4] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nadir_of_American_race_relatio...

[5] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Crow_laws

[6] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sundown_town

[7] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tulsa_race_massacre

[8] http://bostonreview.net/forum/remake-world-slavery-racial-ca...

[9] https://www.dissentmagazine.org/online_articles/the-urgency-...

[10] https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=3744902

[11] https://www.whitehousegiftshop.com/Presidents-Magnet-p/magpo...

[12] https://www.senate.gov/senators/EthnicDiversityintheSenate.h...

[13] https://www.senate.gov/artandhistory/history/resources/pdf/c...

[14] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilmington_insurrection_of_189...

[15] https://www.instapaper.com/read/1381142307

Re: How the US Legalized Corruption

#35

Post by jaybrendansmith »

Some interesting points. My first thought is that he is incorrect about the dinners and fundraisers ... these are political contributions, and the money here has restrictions on it and can only be spent for the campaign. I would love to see publicly-funded elections, but until the supreme court is changed we must live in this world of fundraisers. However, the speaking fees are an interesting point to say the least. They do seem crazy high, and I had no idea Janet Yellen had made so much money from them. Generally they all do it, but typically not until they are out of office ... raking in millions from the Finance industry seems completely corrupt.

Re: How the US Legalized Corruption

#36

Post by jollofricepeas »

CapmCrackaWaka wrote: post #3

Ugh why bring race into this... Even if the author makes good points, he's not going to convince anyone by saying 'white people have funny words for bribes' in the first paragraph. This is coming from someone who 100% agrees with the rest of the article. Still, I won't share this with anyone I respect.

Yes, it’s triggering but keep reading. The author explains their phrasing.

The author feels there is a double standard where the “white” US perpetually demonizes black and brown countries corruption while excusing their own corruption under the guise of “lobbying”, “speaking fees” and “dinners.”

To the author, it appears to be racism when in fact it may just be hypocrisy (ie. Russia).

Re: How the US Legalized Corruption

#37

Post by ropeladder »

Calls for nuance are missing the point. Nuance is exactly what we need less of, nuance is the trees that hide the forest.

Does Yellen have some professional ethics that guard against her acting in a way that overly favors businesses that have her millions of dollars? I think she does. Are those ethics effective as a guard against corruption in the same way that, well, not taking millions of dollars would be? I doubt it. Money talks.

Maybe even more importantly, it severely hurts the legitimacy of government. How are you supposed to convince people you're on their side if you're making millions from the other side? If your lawyer was getting paid more than you could ever pay to share his wisdom with the other side over a fancy lunch, and then you lost the case, you would have every right to doubt their integrity--even if they had done nothing wrong.

The US would have would have a lot less problems with conservative populism if the centrist technocratic impulse wasn't so often so tone deaf.

Re: How the US Legalized Corruption

#38

Post by fit2rule »

CapmCrackaWaka wrote: post #25
bichiliad wrote: post #16

To the comments that discredit the article for "bringing race into" the discussion, it's worth noting that: 1. the author is not white, nor lives in a place where white people are any sort of majority. 2. politics has largely been dominated by white people for much of America's history, so it's likely fair that these patterns were started and perpetuated by white people. 3. the author doesn't exempt non-white politic…

1) Why does any of this matter? Perspective? 2) Sure, but are these patterns unique to white people? In America, sure, but what about corruption in Africa, China, Brazil, pick one. 3) Then why bring race into it? Surely saying something along the lines of 'white people are corrupt... But other races don't get a pass' is only inflammatory and does not help the discussion. 4) Sure, but you can have valid points and dis…

>1) Why does any of this matter? Perspective?

Because the world is not white, and its not American.

Re: How the US Legalized Corruption

#39

Post by fit2rule »

Tade0 wrote: post #32
bichiliad wrote: post #16

To the comments that discredit the article for "bringing race into" the discussion, it's worth noting that: 1. the author is not white, nor lives in a place where white people are any sort of majority. 2. politics has largely been dominated by white people for much of America's history, so it's likely fair that these patterns were started and perpetuated by white people. 3. the author doesn't exempt non-white politic…

Americans are not the only white people out there. I'm eastern-European, we have regular corruption around here and I see no correlation between that and my skin tone.

Its not about whether you are corrupt or not.

Its about whether you have the balls to call it corruption, up front, or brand it something else with some sort of milquetoast explanation for why its okay to accept 'bribes' if they are called 'campaign donations'.

I would wager in Eastern-Europe, you have the balls to call a bribe a bribe.

Re: How the US Legalized Corruption

#40

Post by Judgmentality »

bichiliad wrote: post #16

To the comments that discredit the article for "bringing race into" the discussion, it's worth noting that: 1. the author is not white, nor lives in a place where white people are any sort of majority. 2. politics has largely been dominated by white people for much of America's history, so it's likely fair that these patterns were started and perpetuated by white people. 3. the author doesn't exempt non-white politic…

Yeah, I find it bizarre how much people are reacting to that one line. If I had to guess, it's mostly white people because they feel attacked. I assume HN is mostly white males too.
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