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How neutering dogs became the norm

moosenuggets.substack.com

31–40 of 233 posts

Re: How neutering dogs became the norm

#31

The author is claiming that dogs are rare in shelters now and that institutions are actively buying them from the same puppy mills that are being detracted. I can’t see that to be true- look at villa lobos rescue with over 130 pit bulls, and they have a nationwide show trying to adopt out their dogs. Hell my local aspca has 445 dogs looking for a new home within 25 miles of my zip code.

pit bulls are dangerous dogs, unlike most other breeds.

source:

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=pitbull+attack

Edit:

https://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-statistics-fatalities-2019...

69% of fatalities due to dog bites were caused by the same breed.

Re: How neutering dogs became the norm

#32

>When I told one guy that I was thinking of keeping Moose intact, he picked up his Shih Tzu as though Moose was going to mount his precious Tiffany at any second. “As if,” I thought to myself. “Moose is gay.” Wait, what? I'm 95% sure dogs can't be homosexual but someone correct me if I'm wrong..

I used to have 2 male dogs that would go to town on each other, so dogs definitely can be homosexual, but it's probably just pansexuality more than homosexuality.

Re: How neutering dogs became the norm

#33

>When I told one guy that I was thinking of keeping Moose intact, he picked up his Shih Tzu as though Moose was going to mount his precious Tiffany at any second. “As if,” I thought to myself. “Moose is gay.” Wait, what? I'm 95% sure dogs can't be homosexual but someone correct me if I'm wrong..

It's hard to conclusively draw a connection between "displays homosexual behavior" and "is homosexual" in animals, but homosexual behavior has indeed been observed in dogs (as well as lots of other species).

Interestingly, among giraffes, male-male sex is actually much more common than male-female sex, some studies found that up to 90% of giraffe sex was male-male. (One bit on Wikipedia says giraffes are occasionally described as "especially gay", which I found amusing)

Re: How neutering dogs became the norm

#34

The author is claiming that dogs are rare in shelters now and that institutions are actively buying them from the same puppy mills that are being detracted. I can’t see that to be true- look at villa lobos rescue with over 130 pit bulls, and they have a nationwide show trying to adopt out their dogs. Hell my local aspca has 445 dogs looking for a new home within 25 miles of my zip code.

Yeah, that's my experience too. The shelters are full of less popular breeds and mutts. Also a ton of dogs with health problems. Usually they are neglected and have been abused constantly making them much harder to adopt.

I would estimate that at least half of the people who own dogs really should not. All of the aggressive, anxious, barking, fighting, and crying dogs I walk past just drives me nuts.

Re: How neutering dogs became the norm

#35
I did not get the sense that this is a balanced perspective.

The author does have a point that not sterilizing your pet will likely lead to criticism, even though it's a more nuanced situation.

But still — the solution to all of the sourcing problems is "do your research, and get an individual, not a breed".

If there's an actual shortage of adoptable dogs in your area, talk to the shelters about it, and also consider _not getting a pet quite yet_, rather then taking random advice from the internet and telling people to breed their pets.

Personally I'm in France: much less neutering here, but also there's a serious feral cat problem in my village, and also too many puppies. And toxoplasmosis infection rates are massive... it seems like a much more obvious choice to sterilize free-roaming pets, but still many don't.

Re: How neutering dogs became the norm

#37

The author is claiming that dogs are rare in shelters now and that institutions are actively buying them from the same puppy mills that are being detracted. I can’t see that to be true- look at villa lobos rescue with over 130 pit bulls, and they have a nationwide show trying to adopt out their dogs. Hell my local aspca has 445 dogs looking for a new home within 25 miles of my zip code.

pit bulls are dangerous dogs, unlike most other breeds. source: https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=pitbull+attack Edit: https://www.dogsbite.org/dog-bite-statistics-fatalities-2019... 69% of fatalities due to dog bites were caused by the same breed.

pretty much any large dog can seriously fuck you up if they have a mind to. I've seen a chesapeake bay retriever crush a deer's head with his jaws. in the vast majority of cases, a properly socialized dog will not attack a human unprovoked.

Re: How neutering dogs became the norm

#38
As a US veterinarian, I hold a nuanced view of spay/neuter. Nevertheless, I generally recommend it as default for most pet owners, as it goes along with their expectations of what their pet's life will be like. People who elected to leave their dogs intact are often shocked by something down the line.

1. Pyometra. Dogs do not have menopause, but they may stop cycling. When they do they can develop a uterine infection that can become life threatening in hours.

2. Perineal hernias. Unneutered, aging dogs are at risk for pelvic floor weakness that results in specialty surgery (and neutering), costing thousands of dollars.

3. Hit by car. Unneutered pets are much more likely to escape randomly and get hit by cars. Even pets that normally do not run away from their owners.

4. Mammary tumor. Unspayed or late-spayed females are at significantly more risk than those spayed at 6 months.

5. Pregnancy. Shocked pikachu face when the unspayed chihuahua actually did get knocked up by their friend's unneutered chow.

6. Bleeding. All bitches bleed during proestrus.

7. Behavior. The dog-park behavior people like in their pets is the behavior of neutered dogs. Unneutered dogs are much more likely to attempt to dominate the other dogs and get into fights.

That said, it's a trade off. Unneutered males definitely have a different growth pattern and develop a stockier build. They also seem to have significantly fewer issues with the cranial cruciate ligament in the stifle (knee). There are some other, more hand-wavey associations of cancer in golden retrievers related to neutering, but it's hard to tell if that's just an artifact of the data as it's more likely unneutered dogs appear at teaching hospitals for injuries (hit by car, fights) rather than for cancer.

I would love to just recommend people be responsible adults. I wish that the US could be like Norway, where people don't seem to abandon their unneutered animals, and they don't seem to have problems with their bad behavior.

Re: How neutering dogs became the norm

#39
I think this author is missing a major piece of dog park social norms where spaying & neutering are concerned -- behavioral changes that (ostensibly) arise from de-sexing dogs, particularly in neutering males. Maybe they should ask these other dog park goers _why_ they are so interested in status of their dog's reproductive organs...

In my own anecdotal experience, my male golden retriever (who I've spent considerable time socializing and training since adoption at 8 weeks), started to display some territorial and dominance issues around the 18mo mark. This behavior was particularly apparent around other intact males of equal-to-larger sizes than him, and culminated in a defensive fight with another (intact) lab mix.

I made the choice to schedule his neutering that day.

Since then (~6 months ago), his behavior has mellowed out considerably -- far more so than what I would otherwise attribute to maturing. I try not to judge people that harshly who make the choice not to neuter in the area (urban US city), but at the same time believe too many minimize an intact Fuffy's higher (IMO) propensity for dominant and aggressive behavior in social circumstances. Too often have I heard, 'he's a , obviously he wouldn't hurt a fly!' and it really grinds my gears.

Having an intact dog in a denser area is a huge responsibility (beyond potential offspring) and good owners should recognize this..especially if they're bringing these dogs into semi-controlled environments with strangers -- who, I'd posit, are more concerned about a harder-to-control Fluffy stepping over the line and their dog getting injured or worse, rather than causing an unexpected pregnancy.

Re: How neutering dogs became the norm

#40
post #17

Neutering or spaying should be mandatory. So many people “breed” dogs thinking they are going to sell them, who have no business doing so. So many puppies and adult dogs fill our shelters, it’s very sad.

The article actually talks about a shortage of adoptable dogs due to mass de-sexing, leading to unintended consequences like importing puppies

Talks about, but provides little evidence for. Banning puppy mills and letting dogs breed freely is hardly a solution.
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