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Linus Torvalds on the new MacBook Air

realworldtech.com

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Re: Linus Torvalds on the new MacBook Air

#31

Post by 013a »

hadrien01 wrote: post #20

Can you install Linux on the Surface Pro X?

Yes; and from what I've seen in Apple's support documentation, you can install linux on the new M1 machines.

I think the broader point is that the support isn't very good. Its not specifically disallowed by Apple or Microsoft, but the manufacturers, tertiary driver providers, and community just haven't put a lot of time into making it great. I expect the situation will improve, but its unlikely we'll see any support from Apple or Microsoft, which absolutely should be a concern when picking these devices for Linux.

Re: Linus Torvalds on the new MacBook Air

#32

Post by jayflux »

awak3ning wrote: post #18

Honestly, I don't think anyone is holding their breath for the day that corporations like Apple and Microsoft give the world the Linux that they deserve. Imagine if these power brokers didn't exist and a whole generation of children grew up on Linux rather than Mac/PC. Huge opportunity cost for society in my opinion.

> Honestly, I don't think anyone is holding their breath for the day that corporations like Apple and Microsoft give the world the Linux that they deserve.

I don’t understand this comment. What are you expecting Apple, Microsoft to do? They’re not charities, they make competing OS’s for profit. Why would anyone be waiting for them to bring Linux?

Re: Linus Torvalds on the new MacBook Air

#33

Post by actuator »

zebus806 wrote: post #15

I don’t know why we keep caring what he thinks

Well, for one he created Linux and Git, two softwares which have been something I(and I am guessing most on HN) have loved since I first used them and earn my livelihood from.

The other thing being, he is pretty blunt on issues and provides a very good perspective. Considering the fact that he has headed a project which is so influential(servers, Android etc), I would want to know his opinion on this topic at least as it concerns future of OSs.

Re: Linus Torvalds on the new MacBook Air

#34

Post by Waterluvian »

awak3ning wrote: post #18

Honestly, I don't think anyone is holding their breath for the day that corporations like Apple and Microsoft give the world the Linux that they deserve. Imagine if these power brokers didn't exist and a whole generation of children grew up on Linux rather than Mac/PC. Huge opportunity cost for society in my opinion.

I cannot imagine punishing my children with Linux. I use it every day and love it but it's just such a rough edged by nerds for nerds OS.

If they want to get into programming and computer science then absolutely. But for the 98% of other walks of life I would give them a Mac so that the OS part of their day disappears into the background.

Re: Linus Torvalds on the new MacBook Air

#35

Post by spijdar »

tech5000 wrote: post #6

> I've been waiting for an ARM laptop that can run Linux for a long time. I wonder if the Pinebook Pro would suit some Linux laptop use cases? Its an ARM laptop for $200, no fan, that ships with Manjaro Linux installed.

As someone happily tinkering on a Pinephone, I just don't think the RK3399 is going to satiate Linus's hunger for performance. I think there's some implied subtext "that is actually fast enough for my needs".

He's currently running a 32 core Ryzen desktop CPU, an upgrade he consciously chose over a lesser chip for its improved build speeds. He's also lamented poor screen quality and resolutions before, and I imagine the PBP's would not impress him.

The Air is notable because its processor can run build jobs (like compiling the Linux kernel) in stellar times. While the RK3399 has dual A72s and should be ... better than, say, the pinephone, I'd imagine it's closer to 2010~ish core 2 duos in performance.

Re: Linus Torvalds on the new MacBook Air

#37

Post by IshKebab »

jayflux wrote: post #32
awak3ning wrote: post #18

Honestly, I don't think anyone is holding their breath for the day that corporations like Apple and Microsoft give the world the Linux that they deserve. Imagine if these power brokers didn't exist and a whole generation of children grew up on Linux rather than Mac/PC. Huge opportunity cost for society in my opinion.

> Honestly, I don't think anyone is holding their breath for the day that corporations like Apple and Microsoft give the world the Linux that they deserve. I don’t understand this comment. What are you expecting Apple, Microsoft to do? They’re not charities, they make competing OS’s for profit. Why would anyone be waiting for them to bring Linux?

They don't need to do much - just document things, and make it possible to disable secure boot.

Re: Linus Torvalds on the new MacBook Air

#38

Post by yxhuvud »

jsheard wrote: post #4
rijoja wrote: post #2

So it seems that what could be problematic is not getting it to boot but rather how to get proper graphics support. How difficult would it be to reverse engineer the GPU?

If the reverse engineered Nvidia GPU drivers are any indication, very difficult They're functional for very basic desktop stuff but 3D performance is abysmal

A big reason for the abysmal performance is however that nvidia has intentionally locked down the performance for code that doesn't have the right credentials. We don't know if Apple have done something similar.

Re: Linus Torvalds on the new MacBook Air

#39

Post by 0df8dkdf »

I have dual boated mac and linux for some time.

They main thing about running linux on mac are the drivers. All the touch pad are design to use with macOS.

Using mac is a also new way of using user interface with multi-touch and scroll.

Re: Linus Torvalds on the new MacBook Air

#40

Post by stu2b50 »

dehrmann wrote: post #22
djhworld wrote: post #14

I'm really not holding out much hope that Linux will natively run on these M1s, even if we get it to boot there's all the driver issues for the integrated GPU, audio, wifi etc. I'd imagine there is a lot of power management stuff on there too.

Bootcamp only really worked because Apple did the work. I'm sure they could do the same for Linux, but it would be harder because there's less commoditized hardware and possibly less demand because fewer people run Linux on their laptops than Windows.

There's also just less reason to run Linux for most consumers. Bootcamp was valuable because there's a lot of legacy, proprietary software and drivers that some people must use, which bootcamp gives them access to on the same device.

On the other hand, notable software on Linux are all FOSS. If there was sufficient demand there's nothing stopping someone from making a MacOS compatible release. And indeed, most FOSS developer tools do have MacOS binaries.

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