One sad truth of being an adult male in the West is being expected to be expendable.
Al my sympathy to the author.
A divorce in Italy destroyed my researcher career
31–40 of 112 posts
Re: A divorce in Italy destroyed my researcher career
#32Wait, a web developer makes 1600 Euros but a "shop assistant" makes 3/4 of that?
Re: A divorce in Italy destroyed my researcher career
#33Earlier quoted context omitted.
The mother being treated/expected to be more of a parent does not start at divorce. That's simply the continuation of a societal expectation that women will do the 'mothering.' Because that social expectation is there, it is far more often true that in a hetro marriage the wife will be the one who gives up their career path to take care of a child. Thus the court systems has standardized on an expectation that the mo…
> Because that social expectation is there [...] The court should temper society's vices not empower them.
What does that look like in this situation? I agree, in theory, but _how_ is it applied to a divorce? How does it apply to the financial power imbalance of 'breadwinner' and 'active parent?'
I'm also curious, what is the 'vice' in this statement?
Re: A divorce in Italy destroyed my researcher career
#34The crux of the argument here seems to be that the author doesn't want to pay 650euros a month in child support for his kid. I have very little sympathy. The important person in all of this is the child, not him. His life is going to suck and he'll have no money. That's unfortunate but if the choice is between his life being rubbish and the child's life being rubbish it's a bit of a no-brainer.
Re: A divorce in Italy destroyed my researcher career
#35I love how everyone complains "divorce is so unfair", but Mens Rights is considered a slur.
Re: A divorce in Italy destroyed my researcher career
#36Really is a shame to see this common thread of most Western family court systems not caught up with the times; despite the workforce effectively doubling in the past 60 years, the financial burden is still unnecessarily placed on the man, many times to the point of their financial ruin. Yet this is never covered in any media ever. It's no different here in the US. And then some states like CA have truly bizarre things like "no-fault" (I think that's the term) marriages where after 10 years of marriage, the woman can initiate divorce for whatever reason and it always results in their receiving 50% of the husband's assets, and alimony, and the husband has no recourse at all (you can see many examples of this in celebrity marriages throughout the years).
Re: A divorce in Italy destroyed my researcher career
#37I doubt this is limited to Italy. It has become a meme that a guy is likely to suffer more during a separation if she is motivated and gets herself a good lawyer. If she insists to get the kids, she will. If she doesnt want him to see them very often, she will get her will. I am sure there are examples where it was the other way around. No question. However, the way how the mother is treated as more of a parent then…
The mother being treated/expected to be more of a parent does not start at divorce. That's simply the continuation of a societal expectation that women will do the 'mothering.' Because that social expectation is there, it is far more often true that in a hetro marriage the wife will be the one who gives up their career path to take care of a child. Thus the court systems has standardized on an expectation that the mo…
The standardization that you mention is the problem. The court is supposed to evaluate each case separately, not on a misguided one-size-fits-all policy.
Re: A divorce in Italy destroyed my researcher career
#38Wait, a web developer makes 1600 Euros but a "shop assistant" makes 3/4 of that?
In Poland, Czechia, or even Germany - yes. In Italy and Spain they're lucky if even have a developer job and that would be considered a good salary.
1200 for shop assistant is rather unlikely.
Re: A divorce in Italy destroyed my researcher career
#39Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Because that social expectation is there [...] The court should temper society's vices not empower them.
The court should rule with a bias in favour of the person who had to sacrifice their career to care for the children, regardless of their gender.
What if that's both? What if it's neither? What if is the higher earner that sacrificed an even higher position - do you make the lower earner pay them?
There are other factors involved too.
Re: A divorce in Italy destroyed my researcher career
#40Earlier quoted context omitted.
The court should rule with a bias in favour of the person who had to sacrifice their career to care for the children, regardless of their gender.
What if that's both? What if it's neither? What if is the higher earner that sacrificed an even higher position - do you make the lower earner pay them? There are other factors involved too.
> What if that's both? What if it's neither?
Then the court doesn't need to show a particular bias towards either party on this subject. As you have very astutely pointed out, there exist other circumstances which may compel a court to apply a bias one way or another. That's what courts are for.
> What if is the higher earner that sacrificed an even higher position - do you make the lower earner pay them?
If a decade of childcare materially and demonstrably damaged their future career, they should take that into account. If not, no.
Please pay attention to the words I'm using - 'bias'. This means putting some weight on the scales, not dropping a bag of bricks on one of them.